| Home | Articles | Blog | Reviews | Spoken | Books | Biographical | Middle East Forum | About this site | Mailing List |
The Perfect Argument ... Q.E.D.
Reader comment on item: Islam vs. Islamism (article)
in response to reader comment: Almost getting there, and then the familiar U-turn
Submitted by Domenic Pepe (United States), May 14, 2013 at 11:57
Mr. Thompson has made the perfect argument clearly demonstrating that once islam/islamism becomes "moderate" through the rejection of particular 1400 year old essential and core koranic and sharia psychopathic, supremacist, hateful, oppressive, aggressive, murderous, anti-freedom directives, then islam itself will no longer be islam. Q.E.D (quod erat demonstrandum)
Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".
Reader comments (179) on this item
 |
 |
Title | Commenter | Date | Thread |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Definition or Meaning of "Islamism" beginning in 1747. [181 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Ludvikus | Feb 10, 2022 00:22 | 278810 | |
| 1 | Islamism as an Ideology [399 words] | Ludvikus | Feb 8, 2022 10:20 | 278764 | |
| "Saudi Arabia will return to moderate, open Islam" [54 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | PezDispenser | Oct 25, 2017 01:21 | 241152 | ||
 Retrovision - Does Islam Today Represent Islam of any Prior Age? [437 words] | M Tovey | Mar 15, 2021 19:58 | 241152 | ||
| 2 | Terrorism is Normative, nor "Radical" in Islam [2322 words] | Uncle Vladdi | Feb 14, 2015 02:57 | 221058 | |
| 1 | "Islamism" [173 words] | Dajjal | Feb 17, 2015 02:21 | 221058 | |
| 1 | Muslim apostates exit even in Saudi Arabia [500 words] | dhimmi no more | May 18, 2014 12:35 | 214875 |
| true political islam = westerm liberal democracy (3/4 rashodoun kalipha (somewhat) elected) [123 words] | hussain | Jan 10, 2014 15:45 | 212571 | ||
| 3 | Islam is islam [90 words] | albert snow | Jun 13, 2013 06:17 | 206939 | |
| 5 | A muslim is a muslim is a muslim [253 words] | Jonathan Livingstone Seagull | Jul 21, 2013 01:12 | 206939 | |
| Islamism; The Tool of Totalitarians. [132 words] | Karimi Karim | Jun 10, 2013 10:29 | 206871 | ||
| 2 | Islamist and not-Islamist [114 words] | Ameer (Istanbul) | Jun 4, 2013 21:50 | 206688 | |
| 2 | Low level islamic terrorism [34 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Vijay | May 29, 2013 07:52 | 206558 | |
| 7 | As i browse [77 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 24, 2013 22:59 | 206311 | |
| 4 | Muhammad of the Medina period [63 words] | marlan | May 23, 2013 04:32 | 206246 | |
| Muhammad in the Medina period [46 words] | Prashant | Apr 24, 2017 04:32 | 206246 | ||
| 1 | pro-Sharia does not necessarily means islamist [45 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Gato Branco | May 23, 2013 02:36 | 206244 | |
| 16 | Let us call a spade a spade [583 words] | Lorthog | May 22, 2013 22:42 | 206242 | |
| 4 | Real Confrontation of Lunatic islamism is Absolutely Required [97 words] | Domenic Pepe | May 24, 2013 09:29 | 206242 | |
| Muhammad of the Medina period ? [63 words] | marlan | May 22, 2013 18:22 | 206238 | ||
| Not so much successful [671 words] | Gato Branco | May 22, 2013 03:52 | 206221 | ||
| Islam and Islamism are the same ideology and religion [371 words] | Martin Weidhaas | May 21, 2013 01:02 | 206197 | ||
| 10 | Monumetal Odds [104 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 20, 2013 04:45 | 206186 | |
| I am non-plussed at Daniel's position on Islamism vs Islam. [122 words] | Michael Mckee | May 20, 2013 02:31 | 206182 | ||
| 3 | What can we learn from Egypt again [198 words] | dhimmi no more | May 19, 2013 15:21 | 206172 | |
| My forced conversion [35 words] | Ali Baba | May 23, 2013 16:16 | 206172 | ||
| 3 | Victims of Arabian imperialism [422 words] | dhimmi no more | May 24, 2013 17:44 | 206172 | |
| 4 | "peaceful sufis"?? [38 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Viola Briatkova | May 19, 2013 14:26 | 206170 | |
| 3 | Peaceful Sufis - yup, just as peaceful as Sunnis and Shias!! [151 words] | Jaladhi | May 22, 2013 20:57 | 206170 | |
| 10 | Sufis are hypocrites and they are paying for it [297 words] | dhimmi no more | May 26, 2013 07:17 | 206170 | |
| 2 | Peaceful Sufis_- Not!! [285 words] | Jaladhi | May 28, 2013 16:48 | 206170 | |
| 1 | A Muslim-free Islam debate [39 words] | Robert Wielaard | May 19, 2013 02:59 | 206159 | |
| 10 | Islamism is nothing but Jihad and all Muslims follow it!! [125 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Jaladhi | May 18, 2013 17:56 | 206151 | |
| 1 | So what is the answer [85 words] | Valin | May 18, 2013 19:13 | 206151 | |
| 5 | Must we really be making excuses for Islam? [218 words] | Tom | May 22, 2013 11:52 | 206151 | |
| 6 | Spread the truth about Islam far and wide!!! [263 words] | Jaladhi | May 22, 2013 18:27 | 206151 | |
| A reply [261 words] | Valin | May 25, 2013 07:43 | 206151 | ||
| The Truth? [13 words] | Valin | May 25, 2013 07:48 | 206151 | ||
| What the future looks like: [108 words] | Froike | Jun 21, 2013 12:14 | 206151 | ||
| defeating the Islamists [44 words] | akt | Mar 8, 2015 08:07 | 206151 | ||
| 22 | Dr. Pipes is mistaken [576 words] | Lorthog | May 18, 2013 02:24 | 206138 | |
| 5 | America Betrayed by Its Own Leadership [585 words] | Domenic Pepe | May 19, 2013 15:18 | 206138 | |
| 3 | Caught between a rock and a hard place? [335 words] | Dian Kjaergaard | May 20, 2013 18:04 | 206138 | |
| secularists in India [13 words] | akt | Mar 4, 2015 10:07 | 206138 | ||
| 4 | Question your "(islamists) have an impact beyond their limited numbers [65 words] | Alan Kushnir | May 17, 2013 21:07 | 206131 | |
| 1 | how instrumental is the Left? [191 words] | myth | May 17, 2013 16:24 | 206126 | |
| 7 | I think Mr. Pipes is somewhat off about why Islam was adopted by so many. [255 words] | JB | May 17, 2013 01:45 | 206114 | |
| 7 | "liberal thinkers and universalists" or the grand US strategy to help worldwide Islamists fight kafirs [203 words] | Ianus | May 18, 2013 02:57 | 206114 | |
| 1 | There is much in what Dreyfuss has to say but I do not think that US sins against [86 words] | JB | May 19, 2013 04:03 | 206114 | |
| 5 | American Power as the saudi/islamic Mercenary Army [294 words] | Domenic Pepe | May 19, 2013 18:18 | 206114 | |
| Obama's speech on terrorism: Yes, they can! [115 words] | JB | May 24, 2013 11:22 | 206114 | ||
| 5 | Islam vs. Islamism [173 words] | Bart Benschop | May 16, 2013 23:52 | 206112 | |
| -ism [24 words] | Eugene | May 16, 2013 14:44 | 206105 | ||
| 9 | Islam vs Islamism - good cop vs bad cop [202 words] | Danny Green | May 16, 2013 10:31 | 206098 | |
| 1 | Not Moderate Muslims, but DEMOCRATIC Muslims [330 words] | Demolan | May 16, 2013 09:15 | 206096 | |
| 2 | democracy/rule of law [79 words] | leigh | May 18, 2013 05:31 | 206096 | |
| 4 | Why not to make some parallels [45 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Roman | May 15, 2013 22:10 | 206083 | |
| 3 | some parallels in West Germany post 1945 [406 words] | myth | May 16, 2013 05:26 | 206083 | |
| 18 | More insights [93 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 17, 2013 19:05 | 206083 | |
| 4 | Anti-Islam [100 words] | Tom | May 17, 2013 23:53 | 206083 | |
| will the victory of anti Islamists have similar consequences for Muslims as Germans and Russians today [120 words] | Shishir | May 21, 2013 02:05 | 206083 | ||
| 4 | Was Mahomet a terrorist ? [49 words] | Ianus | May 15, 2013 18:26 | 206080 | |
| 6 | The founder of Islam and history [259 words] | dhimmi no more | May 16, 2013 06:31 | 206080 | |
| 8 | If Mahomet was a terrorist and all Moslems want to be like Mahomet , then ... let's forget the politically correct ruse of "Islam vs. Islamism" . [109 words] | Ianus | May 18, 2013 02:21 | 206080 | |
| 4 | Slight correction [89 words] | dhimmi no more | May 18, 2013 06:01 | 206080 | |
| 1 | I encourage everyone to read Sirat Al-Rasul [174 words] | Reporter | May 19, 2013 04:17 | 206080 | |
| 9 | Islam, anti-blasphemy laws. the Benghazi atrocity and our leaders that are beyond help [410 words] | dhimmi no more | May 19, 2013 08:40 | 206080 | |
| 4 | Our dear reporter is saying that Muhammad was a warlord for only 10 years! What a disaster [966 words] | dhimmi no more | May 21, 2013 07:36 | 206080 | |
| 3 | And I encourage you our dear reporter to leave islam and the Arabs and their imperialism [63 words] | dhimmi no more | May 21, 2013 15:54 | 206080 | |
| 1 | Read the koran now [62 words] | Tom | May 22, 2013 19:41 | 206080 | |
| 1 | Ibn Is-haq and Ibn Hisham [96 words] | Reporter | May 25, 2013 02:04 | 206080 | |
| The truth is next to you [96 words] | Report | May 25, 2013 02:08 | 206080 | ||
| 2 | The victims of Arabian imperialism [354 words] | dhimmi no more | May 26, 2013 07:47 | 206080 | |
| 1 | Victims of Arabian imperialism [362 words] | dhimmi no more | May 26, 2013 08:01 | 206080 | |
| Al-Tableghee dhimmi ...... [22 words] | Reporter | May 27, 2013 02:25 | 206080 | ||
| 1 | Mr. Tabligheee [116 words] | Reporter | May 27, 2013 02:33 | 206080 | |
| 1 | pribed Tabligheeee [97 words] | Reporter | May 27, 2013 02:41 | 206080 | |
| 2 | Exposing ignorant tablighees and wannabe Arabs [312 words] | dhimmi no more | May 28, 2013 07:02 | 206080 | |
| 1 | Exposing ignorant tablighees and wannabe Arabs again [639 words] | dhimmi no more | May 28, 2013 07:59 | 206080 | |
| 3 | Lost tablighees and islam is the religion of the Arabs only [553 words] | dhimmi no more | May 30, 2013 07:20 | 206080 | |
| Not true [271 words] | Tom | Jun 14, 2013 13:50 | 206080 | ||
| Muhammad battles [917 words] | Reporter | Jun 16, 2013 16:23 | 206080 | ||
| 8 | the flaw in Pipe's argument [78 words] | Martin E. Weinstein | May 15, 2013 12:35 | 206076 | |
| 1 | organizing the majority against a minority in power [81 words] | myth | May 17, 2013 08:40 | 206076 | |
| 4 | Correct analysis, one false conclusion possibly [669 words] | Alexandros | May 15, 2013 05:51 | 206070 | |
| 2 | Islam or Islamism? [101 words] | Michal | May 15, 2013 04:34 | 206069 | |
| 4 | Peaceful military conquest? [178 words] | Hrishi | May 15, 2013 01:32 | 206068 | |
| 2 | Islam's Two Futures are Related to Islam and Islamism [260 words] | Randall B | May 15, 2013 01:01 | 206065 | |
| 4 | The West not to blame for Islamism [236 words] | M Taylor | May 14, 2013 23:35 | 206062 | |
| 7 | Christianism and Islamism [436 words] | There is NO Santa Claus | May 14, 2013 23:30 | 206061 | |
| for 'NO Santa Claus' [56 words] | Randall B | May 16, 2013 02:31 | 206061 | ||
| 2 | weak comparison [198 words] | Tom | May 17, 2013 14:25 | 206061 | |
| Could Muslims themselves in big numbers not realise their chance of winning in the West is remote and change? [357 words] | Demolan | May 14, 2013 22:48 | 206059 | ||
| 2 | We keep waiting for the 85% moderate moderate muslims to speak out against islamism. [25 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Phil Greend | May 14, 2013 21:08 | 206056 | |
| 2 | On who does the onus fall? [73 words] | Prashant | May 16, 2013 12:20 | 206056 | |
| 6 | Moderate vs Radical Islamists [91 words] | akt | May 17, 2013 21:07 | 206056 | |
| 3 | Islamic Believers versus the Lukewarm [244 words] | J Glueck | May 14, 2013 19:20 | 206055 | |
| 4 | America and Islamism - friends for ever [134 words] | Ianus | May 18, 2013 08:38 | 206055 | |
| 3 | In what do Islamists differ from Muhammad? [44 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Mladen Andrijasevic | May 14, 2013 17:06 | 206054 | |
| Mohammad reflected the mores of his times [93 words] | Prashant | May 16, 2013 12:14 | 206054 | ||
| Interesting [39 words] | Hamza | May 8, 2015 16:33 | 206054 | ||
| Serious Discussion [59 words] | Nick | May 14, 2013 11:59 | 206051 | ||
| thanks and then some [309 words] | john w. mcginley | May 14, 2013 07:59 | 206040 | ||
| 9 | There is only one Islam and it is not pretty [232 words] | dhimmi no more | May 14, 2013 07:12 | 206039 | |
| 2 | islamization yes or no [106 words] | myth | May 14, 2013 05:46 | 206035 | |
| 1 | more distinctions in the islamic spectrum, more tactics needed [425 words] | myth | May 14, 2013 05:15 | 206034 | |
| How do you define moderate Islam? Doesnt moderation often lead to apostasy as Muslims,not just Islamists fear? [169 words] | Shishir | May 14, 2013 03:25 | 206032 | ||
| Moderation [57 words] | AAA | May 18, 2013 23:44 | 206032 | ||
| 1 | Islam vs Jihadism [147 words] | Dean Mohr | May 14, 2013 00:49 | 206027 | |
| 25 | It is just a Double Paradox [129 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 14, 2013 00:45 | 206026 | |
| 20 | How Many were Against Hitler during the Holocaust? [20 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 16, 2013 09:23 | 206026 | |
| 5 | I disagree, Mr. Morcos [180 words] | There is NO Santa Claus | May 17, 2013 08:02 | 206026 | |
| 7 | the Nazi paradox remains stunning [127 words] | myth | May 17, 2013 16:45 | 206026 | |
| 22 | I respectfully disagree [132 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 18, 2013 04:41 | 206026 | |
| 7 | A lesson from Mom [110 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 18, 2013 20:25 | 206026 | |
| 3 | Most non-Islamist Muslims are not anti-Islamists [64 words] | Arthur Cohn | May 14, 2013 00:15 | 206024 | |
| Why moderates do not condemn radicals [91 words] | Gato Branco | May 22, 2013 04:19 | 206024 | ||
| 4 | History, when wrong, must be criticized [516 words] | Prashant | May 13, 2013 23:50 | 206023 | |
| 3 | integration of Muslims into western society's concept of government, [424 words] | rodney allsworth | May 13, 2013 23:14 | 206022 | |
| 1 | Solution to Islamism [20 words] | Gary Clarke | May 13, 2013 21:48 | 206017 | |
| Defeating Islamism [12 words] | Clifford Ishii | May 13, 2013 21:48 | 206016 | ||
| 2 | Accurate analysis. [137 words] | Lucretius | May 13, 2013 18:54 | 206010 | |
| 32 | Almost getting there, and then the familiar U-turn [1127 words] | Ron Thompson | May 13, 2013 16:43 | 206008 | |
| 4 | Dear Ron I applaud your insight [84 words] | Bruria Rimoni | May 13, 2013 23:03 | 206008 | |
| 5 |  The Perfect Argument ... Q.E.D. [48 words] | Domenic Pepe | May 14, 2013 11:57 | 206008 | |
| 5 | There is nothing called 'Islamism', only 'Islam' [189 words] | K T Thomas | May 15, 2013 11:35 | 206008 | |
| 2 | Thank you [175 words] | Ron Thompson | May 16, 2013 21:01 | 206008 | |
| 6 | A Good Muslim according to us is a Bad Muslim according to Islam [541 words] | Ron Thompson | May 16, 2013 23:54 | 206008 | |
| Exactly, Ron [41 words] | stanley b | May 17, 2013 23:31 | 206008 | ||
| 1 | Can citizens not be asked to live in countries practicing the political societal system they are loyal too? [510 words] | Demolan | May 18, 2013 02:36 | 206008 | |
| 5 | Very Hard [18 words] | Michael Hanni Morcos | May 18, 2013 19:45 | 206008 | |
| 12 | Symptom or disease? [150 words] | Doug Mayfield | May 13, 2013 15:21 | 206007 | |
| 5 | The crisis of faith isn't new: [134 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Jason Pappas | May 13, 2013 14:19 | 206004 | |
| 69 | The Killer Answer to Defeating islam itself [546 words] | Domenic Pepe | May 13, 2013 14:11 | 206003 | |
| 1 | war on all Islam ? [59 words] | gary Clarke | May 14, 2013 00:32 | 206003 | |
| 5 | agree! [347 words] | Tom | May 14, 2013 11:36 | 206003 | |
| 2 | The defeat of the devil on earth [15 words] | Albert Shanker | May 15, 2013 00:04 | 206003 | |
| 1 | On the Parallel with Nazi Germany and Japanese Militarism [172 words] | Ron Thompson | May 16, 2013 20:41 | 206003 | |
| 1 | DEFEAT ISLAM WITH TRUTH. THIS IS THE ONLY WAY. [388 words] | Mark | May 29, 2013 02:11 | 206003 | |
| DEFEAT ISLAM WITH TRUTH. THIS IS THE ONLY WAY. [11 words] | Mark | Jun 3, 2013 21:23 | 206003 | ||
| What truth [73 words] | sleepless | Jun 13, 2013 20:59 | 206003 | ||
| Truth is not relative! [229 words] | Tom | Jun 18, 2013 14:16 | 206003 | ||
| Facing Reality: Defeating Totalitarian Islam [30 words] | mbplee | Jul 18, 2013 04:31 | 206003 | ||
| 1 | Defeating Islam or Islamism? Neither! [176 words] | Prashant | Jul 19, 2013 02:24 | 206003 | |
| 1 | Extirpate the Evil Inherent in islam itself [148 words] | Domenic Pepe | Jul 20, 2013 17:04 | 206003 | |
| Islam [184 words] | Jim Jennings | Nov 28, 2013 19:39 | 206003 | ||
| islam compared to nazism [88 words] | Bruno | Dec 7, 2013 05:38 | 206003 | ||
| 3 | islam is like nazism because ..... [123 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Domenic Pepe | Dec 9, 2013 00:03 | 206003 | |
| Agree [7 words] | Leo | Aug 18, 2014 08:05 | 206003 | ||
| 6 | Islam vs. Islamism [142 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Gunther H. Sciff | May 13, 2013 13:47 | 206002 | |
| 1 | Great analysis [59 words] | Bruce Birnberg | May 13, 2013 12:56 | 206001 | |
| 4 | Not even as simple as Dr Pipes complicated position [124 words] | M.Orbuch | May 13, 2013 12:55 | 206000 | |
| 7 | Islam by any other name is anti-reason [316 words] | Edward Cline | May 13, 2013 12:51 | 205999 | |
| 2 | Interesting point Edward Cline [169 words] | sara | May 13, 2013 19:34 | 205999 | |
| 4 | Reply to Sara [337 words] | Edward Cline | May 13, 2013 20:24 | 205999 | |
| Catholicism has political power [46 words] | thomas | May 14, 2013 05:59 | 205999 | ||
| And to prove the opposite? [250 words] | Lynn | May 14, 2013 09:20 | 205999 | ||
| 1 | More moderate than Islam assuredly [151 words] | sara | May 16, 2013 00:26 | 205999 | |
| 1 | "Islamism" is but part of a dimension [183 words] | Michael Vanyukov | May 13, 2013 12:12 | 205998 | |
| 4 | Islam vs Islamism! The cameleon! [89 words] | Steven L | May 13, 2013 11:56 | 205997 | |
| 1 | How to defeat islamism [191 words] | Lars Nielsen | May 14, 2013 04:27 | 205997 | |
| 3 | Islam and its byproduct Islamism [107 words] | Steven L | May 16, 2013 11:20 | 205997 | |
| How to defeat Islam(ism) ?! [131 words] | nightcry | Apr 22, 2017 12:44 | 205997 | ||
| Answer to nightcry [147 words] | Lars Nielsen | Apr 24, 2017 06:13 | 205997 | ||
| Completely agree but... [152 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Lory | May 13, 2013 11:56 | 205996 | ||
| 3 | Ah, The Killer Question... [224 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Soloview | May 13, 2013 11:05 | 205995 | |
| 10 | Who with sane mind wants to live in a Moslem state? [50 words] | NuritG | May 13, 2013 11:01 | 205994 | |
| 1 | I concur , Islam is the problem [5 words] | Thomas | May 14, 2013 06:03 | 205994 | |
| Occam's razor!! [35 words] | Jaladhi | May 18, 2013 18:12 | 205994 | ||
| 1 | Distributions need to be understood [386 words] | Amit Srivastava | May 13, 2013 10:48 | 205993 | |
| 2 | Where are the "moderates." [70 words] | Carey Page | May 13, 2013 10:27 | 205992 | |
| 2 | Hope is not a strategy for change [101 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | Barry Wolfe | May 13, 2013 10:27 | 205991 | |
| 3 | "what went wrong" [158 words] | Tom | May 13, 2013 10:18 | 205989 | |
| 6 | There is only one Islam - and it must go, it really must go [700 words] | TL Winslow | May 13, 2013 10:11 | 205988 | |
| 16 | What differentiates Islam from other religions [188 words] | G Marcus | May 13, 2013 10:07 | 205987 | |
| Comparison between Islam and Christiany [28 words] | Thomas | May 14, 2013 06:07 | 205987 | ||
| 3 | Doubt enough Thomas? [82 words] | Tom | May 17, 2013 23:19 | 205987 | |
| 9 | Several polls have shown that a plurality of Moslems support the radicals [189 words] w/response from Daniel Pipes | David S | May 13, 2013 10:00 | 205986 | |
| 1 | IFF - Identify Friend or Foe. Support friend, fight foe. [477 words] | Yeshayhu Hollander | May 13, 2013 09:57 | 205985 |
Latest Articles
Follow Daniel Pipes
All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2024 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes
Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes
(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.
Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.
For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)