Wassim goes to Hollywood!

Submitted by Gary L (United States), Jan 27, 2007 at 07:51

I guess your brain is overloaded now that you have reduced this exchange to name calling. Such a scholarly presence you have...Finally, I am proud to be animated by the Islamic belief in the equality of all men, "you are just stupid enough to think that is an insult "

This is your Olive Branch? All you had to say is that its OK, we can agree to disagree! Thats too easy! instead you play with hidden meanings that I should decipher using quotes from movies. Youve been watching too many cartoons! Wassim goes to Hollywood! Thats a comedy! right? Unlike the Nasser quote I find your statement baseless and unworthy of my attention. Do you always start off with character assasination, putting words in people's mouths, half truths, and misrepresentation of the facts, then close with the offering of hidden olive branch? Aren't you a negotiator for the PLO?

It is confirmed you are a first class Middle Eastern hypocrite! On one hand you speak of a dislike of extremist Islam and yet on the other hand you reward it in the same breath when it serves to destroy Israel. I thought the Palestinians want Peace? In addition, you left out women! Equality for which men? Islamic? only those believers? I guess I should assume the bleeding obvious because youve been sitting on your head too long! In Sudan, Darfur, do we see the equality of all men or do Muslims impose themselves on their Christian counterparts. Hell no! what we see is conversion by the sword! You really must follow the news and get out more! I know it must be difficult for you to keep defending a position for which there is no defense...

Moving on..your last point before the lengthy quotation is also not engaging with the point I made. I know it's difficult for you to actually engage in a conversation that challenges your existing point of view and diverts you from your standard polemic. I'm sorry I didn't add the recompensed sense for Jewish refugees from the Arab world but I think it's a statement of the bleeding obvious I meant it in the same sense as that of Palestinians. I will engage you when you offer me something resembling a challenging conversation worthy of my engaging, rather than a distorted view of history. My lengthy quotation is part of a valid argument regarding the historical timeline for which you fail to address in substance.

The very people that Israel has displaced are the descendants of these people

What people? This statement alone tells me your intellect is from a revisionist thinking and a manufactured belief that Palestinians are descendants of (these) people. Which people are they descendants of ? All of them? or just some of them? You not only can't prove your statement you have once again failed to supply me with anything worthy of my attention.

Maybe you can find the time to research this too!

In an interview with the Dutch newspaper "Trau" (March 31,1977, PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein said:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism.

"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa. While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."

How many countries did your precious Western civilization conquer and please lets not mention the slave trade shall we? (forget it, I'm not even going to bother engaging with this point).

I fail to see you mention one country? Don't you know? As I said, Israel is not in the business of conquering nations. You make many statements but fail to back it up with anything of substance but your own rhetoric. Oh Wassim doesn't want to mention the slave trade! Such a fragile subject for you! Whats the matter your history books don't go back that far? Isn't slavery still practiced in the Middle East or shall we play a verbal shell game? In fact would you deny that Islam permits slaves? Are these not facts or do I need to send you footnotes for this too?

The Pan-Arab issue, yes I proudly say it is. If anything I do believe in Pan Arabism. Considering the nation states of the current Middle East were spun into being with decolonization I'm not surprised that the Palestinian issue was created "after" the Zionist usurpation of Palestine. You still miss the point that though you allege their identity as Palestinians was manufactured, they were still refugees and a refugee is one who no longer lives on his land and has sought refuge elsewhere. Please try to focus.

If you believe in Pan Arabism, tell me how much the Arab states have welcomed the Palestinians and done their best to resettle them?

In 1948, the Arabs willlfully left with the promise by their leaders they would return and wipe the Jews into the sea. In six wars the Arabs attacked Israel and lost, Israel defended itself and won.

After the 1948 war, Egypt controlled the Gaza Strip and its more than 200,000 inhabitants, but refused to allow the Palestinians into Egypt or permit them to move elsewhere. Egypts handling of the Palestinians in Gaza was so bad Saudi Arabian radio compared Nasser' regime in Gaza to Hitler's rule in occupied Europe in World War II (Isi Liebler, The Case for Israel, Australia: The Globe Press, 1972, p.43).

"It is shameful that the Arab governments should prevent the Arab refugees from working in their countries and shut the doors in their faces and imprison them in camps" (Musa Alami, "The Lesson of Palestine," Middle East Journal, October 1949, p. 386). Most refugees, however, focused their discontentment on "the Zionists," whom they blamed for their predicament rather than the vanquished Arab armies.

"The Arab States do not want to solve the refugee problem. They want to keep it as an open sore, as an affront to the United Nations and as a weapon against Israel. Arab leaders don't give a damn whether the refugees live or die."

former director of UNRWA, Ralph Garroway, in August 1958

Stop me if I'm going too fast for your fragile eggshell mind!

Many Arabs living in Israel have it better than Arabs living abroad.

Arab Israeli patriotism: According to a new poll released in January 2007 (Uzi Arad and Gal Alon, "Patriotism and Israel's National Security - Herzliya Patriotism Survey 2006," Herzliya: Institute for Policy and Strategy, 2006), 82 percent of Israeli Arabs said it is "better to be a citizen of my country than others." By comparison, 90 percent of Americans agreed with the statement and 88 percent of Israeli Jews. While almost everyone in the survey from Ireland and the United States said they were proud to be a citizen of their country, 83 percent of Israeli Jews said they were proud and 44 percent of Israeli Arabs. Another 27 percent of Israeli Arabs said they were willing to fight for their country, an increase from 22 percent in 2000. While still well below the overwhelming 94 percent of Israeli Jews who are prepared to fight ( Finland was second with 83 percent and the U.S. third with 63 percent), it is significant that more than one-quarter of Israeli Arabs, who are exempt from military service, are still prepared to defend their nation.

Analyzing the survey data it is clear why Israeli Arabs are adamant about remaining citizens of Israel and express no desire to be part of a Palestinian state. The results also illustrate why Palestinian Arabs in the territories express a high regard for Israel in polls. They see how their fellow Arabs are treated and the type of society Israel has built and wish to emulate it.

This tombstone thing I can see you are quite happy with and won't let go. OK so somebody defiled some tombstones. My point is that this is not the institutionalised religious view of Islam against Judaism, my point was to show that such actions are not religious. What I did want to know genuinely was where did you read that this happened? Who made this claim and how can I read it? That is why you have to always state your sources. Nice quote from Nasser and yes the point has never been about letting the Zionists get away with their occupation, nor will it ever be. Also, please do follow the news as I think you might actually like the PLO (Fatah) and their new found identity. I'll let this one pass.

OK so somebody defiled some tombstones? Who cares what you think about institutionalised religious view of Islam against Judaism. I never took it to mean that! ... The original point was if the tables were turned and it happened to Muslims or Islamic holy places the whole Muslim and non Muslim world would cry foul. The Jordanian government failed to protect these holy places knowing full well of the outcome. The Jordanian's prevented Jews and Christians from having access to these holy sites during the occupation of Jerusalem between 1948-1967. Unlike the Israelis who allow access to all faiths.

Yes, I did not deny the Yom Kippur War and I don't know why you bring this up again. You've really got to engage in this discussion if we're going to move forward. When you present some facts that are worth engaging we can move forward only when I decide chump! Your acknowledgment of the Yom Kippur War just like most of what you say is a joke!

Zionism has conquered the only country that matters to the Arabs, Palestine. That is still the issue as Pilger said. What about conquest? You want me to answer for men who died thousands of years ago? How many countries did your precious Western civilization conquer and please lets not mention the slave trade shall we? (forget it, I'm not even going to bother engaging with this point).

Once again your assertions are baseless! You make absurd statements like Zionism has conquered the only country that matters to the Arabs, Palestine. As I stated previously there never has been in the history of the world a (sovereign country) called Palestine that was ruled by Palestinians. Yet you profess this to be the case without providing one shred of evidence to support this? When you answer with some form of evidence I will move this conversation forward. Until then, get your next movie quote ready! Yes, I want you to answer for men who died thousands of years ago? Put up or shut up! ...

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