Freedom of speech isnt an excuse to insult religions, its the right to say what you believe even if a religion is going to choose to be offended.

Submitted by bos (United Kingdom), Mar 7, 2008 at 21:50

"Crusade was a catholic concept of religiously sanctioned 'just' war" FALSE
at the time of the first crusades, the Western Christian church was not split

there were deep fissures, but your right there was no official split, so that would have made them?...think it through?..............ok one clue - CATHOLIC

they originaly were religious INJUSTIFIED wars against muslims.

you call them unjustified because they were against muslims, but you give no evidence and certainly dont address the other side of the argument, why is the muslim conquest of these lands irelevent, why is the brutalities inflicted on christians and pilgrims during the intra muslim violence of the time irrelevent? why is the renewed invasion of christian lands in what is now Turkey irelevent?

like most other islamist apologists I get the impression that if a muslim murdered an innocent kaffir and got blood on his clothes you would call it an incident of unjustified anti muslim bleeding.

and please note i have not made an argument in favour of the crusades, merely explained the concept and the context.

as a matter of fact the concept of religious wars is not an Islamic term by any means.
The Arabic word Jihad is from the three letter root (Jhd), which means to do your best,

You dont actually speak arabic do you?, seriously denying jihad means holy war is disingenous nonsense at best, at worst its just stupidity (or the other way round depends on your view) there is a regular on this site called Dhimmi no more, seek him out and get some arabic lessons, if nothing else i will be entertained.

The conditions in Spain improved so much under Muslim rule that Jews from all across Europe came to live in Spain during this Jewish renaissance."

you cansay the same about germany and poland, and if you wanted to cherry pick five minutes of there history you could give people the impression that they were the worlds most tolerant society's, especially for jews. The golden age was not as good as the name suggests but it was real, it is not however the embodiment of spanish muslim history lazy liberals and prejudiced muslims take it to be, its just a snapshot of a moment in spains muslim history. dont pretend you know anything about spains history, I will wager you couldnt even draw up a timeline with more than a dozen entries (and a half informative one would need hundreds)

Your germany paragraph

this doesnt respond to my point and is just irrelevent. the germans did evil in the thirties and forties so muslims shouldnt condemn the murder of nuns (or any one else) in their name, and should go on the rampage because of academic lectures????????? what on earth are you talking about, is this some form of twisted obscurantist comedy?

A final truly important point is this, the west defeated western fascism itself with huge qand courageous sacrifices, is there anyone in the islamic world even interested in taking on islamofascism/islamism?

Your Iraq paragraph

also doesnt respond to my points. civil wars do occur everywhere there is severe ethnic or ideological division, but this isnt really a civil war, this is nihilistic and fascistic murder of innocent coreligionists based purely on the notion that if they burn enough fellow muslims (albeit often different sects) then an islamist pheonix will rise. do you not believe in the ummah, do you not grieve for these people? how many need to die and be maimed before you shout STOP! instead of "dont apologise lads i blame america". Shame on you, your supposed to be a muslim, fear Allah brother.

this time with the muslim

This genocide envy is sadder than phallus envy, get over it because I dont have time to explain the idiocy of it to someon who is so very unlikely to listen

Antichrist will be from Assyria (Isaiah 10:12, 14:25)

several points:- this region currently contains Christians, Druze, Armenians, Kurds, Alawites, some turcomen and several smaller religious/ethnic groupings

When Issaiah was written it contained no arabs, if the anti christ is real, by the time he comes their may be no arabs there again, or they may be a minority (and thats not supposed to be some warmongering wish) your spouting paranoic sickening victimhood nonsense.

I note you didnt actually list any falsity regarding my comments regarding greece which is of course what this conversation was initially about.

you didnt list one example of the bbc article contradicting me

debating against a position that abandons all fact and data even the subject, in favour of polemic whenever the facts and data dont support the polemic is not informative, it does not improve the participants knowledge or analytical cappacity in any way, it is not fun, it is tedious at best and offensive at worst, I dont want to play an indefinite game of polemic and counter polemic

you say Assalamu alaikum but I dont think you mean it so in response I will say 'and upon the mothers of Iraq, darfur, Kenya, Jerusalem, Gaza, Yemen, the Phillipines, southern Thailand, Uiger, Afghanistan, waziristan, Baluchistan, Kashmir etc etc, because there fellow muslims dont seem willing to do it.

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