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Our European Future - interested

Reader comment on item: Something Rotten in Denmark?

Submitted by Joern E. Vig (Denmark), Oct 7, 2005 at 17:09

Our European Future - interested - Demographically, concisely?

http://lilliput-information.blogspot.com/2005/10/our-future-demografically.html

It is not that we assume you are incapable of simple mathematics, it is only that we are not sure that you recently have done the following calculation.
You should, however, do it. So, please, do correct and comment ours - i.e., give us the benefit of your views.

This is based on the newest statistics from EU's statistical office (figures in bracketts are from other sources, such as Fischer Almanach 2002-2004), supposedly produced in the pauses between the successful embezzlement of our tax payers' money. This press on their schedule may explain that these data are not free from contradictions, but totally free from any reasonable clues. We have to add conclusions ourselves. Here our humble contribution. (To my (Michael Koch:) knowledge, hitherto only Morten Rasmussen December 1st. 2003, Kristeligt Dagblad in Denmark, and some more Danish population scientists like P. C. Matthiessen and private persons (Ebbe Vig et al.) have taken notice of this issue - for some years - which should be of interest to every European citizen.)

Categories Number

1.1. 2002 EU's 15 countries had a population of 377.710.000

1.1. 2003 this population increased to ca. 379.000.000

That means an increase of 1.290.000

Of these were immigrants 988.600

(of these estimated illegal immigrants/asylants ca. 600.000)

(of these to Northern Europe - DK, N, S, SF, ISL c. 60.000)

(All the time, however, some Nostradami, all the same, shout:
'We need a major labour force immigration - we are soon extinct!')

Thus, immigration is the direct source of 76,6% of the total population increase.

(So it has been, in rough figures, for many years. Ten years ago, the illegal immigration to the EU was estimated to be around 400.000, to the Northern countries ca. 40.000.)

That means, only 23,4% of the growth (301.400) are not immigrants, but the outcome of the natural reproduction: births minus death cases, i.e. the resulting nativity excess for the total population - native and newcomers. How are these 301.400 to be distributed into the two latter categories?

The original (native) European population has for many years had no birth excess at all, but shrinks slowly, more markedly for the last decade. During 2002 this birth deficit was in average - 0,7% (- 2,3 million) for the EU countries, a figure which in my opinion the reactions seem to have been exaggerated . In fact, there is incessantly also a tiny stream of emigrants. Other would say Europe is already overpopulated.

Immigrants/asylants are throughout the EU between 5% and 12% of the registered population. Together with naturalized immigrants and the next generation of immigrants, this figure increases to about 10-22% (maximun in Switzerland and Sweden). Furthermore, one has to add illegal and hidden immigrants - for Sweden alone another 20.000. The majority of these immigrants come from regions with markedly higher birth rates (e.g. African and Middle East countries) and they continue to show their reproduction characteristics even in Europe.

It is often said that non-European immigrants rapidly adopt to the birth rates of their new home country, but recent studies have shown that this is a myth. On the contrary, even Third World families increase their birth rates by the order of 1,0, when their living conditions improve. In Northern countries, where the social network of public support is strong (in Sweden, it gives 13 times the financial support of Poland!), a family with many children can live comfortably on this 'income'. Adopting a changing behaviour is a matter of generations. In general, the immigrants' reproduction rate is more than the double of the native population. Today, the immigrants and their offspring in Sweden, 10 resp. 22% of the population, produce 25-35% of the younger school children and 15-25% of the conscripts - a situation which presumably is mirrored throughout Western Europe.

If we assume, that about 12% of Europe's population today are immigrants or of recent immigrants' decent (a rather conservative estimate), we can calculate that the birth excess for this subpopulation of 'new-Europeans' (45,3 million) should be about 2,6 million. Only this would explain a growth with 300.000, though the indigenous population produces a deficit of 2,3 million. In this case, however, the immigrants' birth excess would be 5.7%, which is obviously too much, but we have to consider that younger people are clearly over-representative. Given the basic data are correct, mistakes ought to be looked for in the two parameters 'birth deficit of native Europeans' and 'actual percentage of new-Europeans' - otherwise the number of illegal and total immigrants must - necessarily - be much higher than assumed (1.29 million). These three figures are, by the way, interconnected, because they add to certain sums which we can assert. These 'weak' figures officially available give us an idea of the vage state of our knowledge - many figures are just educated guesses. As a minimum, however, we must assume that much more than the actual birth excess of 300.000 is of immigrants' descent.

That means that not only 76,6%, but considerably more than 200% of EU's population growth is due to immigration.

Is that good or bad? We will leave this aside here, but we should be aware of what is going on. We should have a careful look at the world and the cultures they come from. USA's history shows that they take a lot of their heritage with them.

The total number of muslims in Europe was recently presumed to be about 32,5 million, not including recent asylum seekers, illegal immigrants, naturalized immigrants and their offspring, but including some non-EU regions on the Balkan and in Russia. Their total could soon approach 40 million, 25 million within the EU, which necessarily is to regard as an important source of population growth.

It is crucial to transfer these calculations continuously through the next century. Future generations will have no understanding if we let them down by our negligence. They have no chance to repair the outcome of our slow cerebration. (Or, with other words: What do you think turks or jemenites would do, if Norwegians would begin to expand within their countries?) Remember: Japan accepted 3 (three!) of the Vietnamese 'boat people', USA some millions and Niedersachsen - in the highly overpopulated Western Germany - some 40.000 of them. And if you want to meet African Indians, by Idi Amin expelled from Uganda, please come to Mariestad, a little Swedish town of 16.000 inhabitants at the Lake Vänern.

(Stanislaw Lem: Some omissions are followed by a terrible lack of consequences)

Michael Koch & Joern E. Vig
========================
For your information
'This Something Rotten in Denmark shall be dealt with'

INCREASING ACTIVITY:
Comment and ask questions on
International Economics and Statistical
subjects at: http://lilliput-information.blogspot.com

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subjects: http://www.lilliput-information.com/indexx.htm

Specially statistical learning-modules:
http://www.lilliput-information.com/stati/index.html

Our main website on
Immigration and other politically correct issues
in English: http://www.lilliput-information.com/indexd.htm

Sincerely
Joern E. Vig,
Denmark
Dislike
Submitting....

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to Deepali [76 words]ASJun 20, 2007 16:3645986
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Disgusting entertainment. [375 words]Danish/AmericanMay 1, 2006 09:4944360
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1Danish/American [112 words]JustMeMay 1, 2006 16:0944360
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JustMe [41 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 18, 2006 16:4043001
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JustMe: United we stand, divided they fall [444 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 21, 2006 15:3643001
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1Danish/American Re At last someone with backbone! [241 words]MandyApr 26, 2006 05:5243001
Mandy..you're not the only one disappointed. [185 words]Danish/AmericanApr 26, 2006 19:1543001
Mussaui [34 words]RedMountainHighApr 30, 2006 17:0543001
Moussaoui ... [98 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 30, 2006 18:0543001
Zacarias Moussaoui [97 words]JustMeApr 30, 2006 21:1943001
RE: for innocent and curious [40 words]Solan GundersenJan 23, 2010 17:1543001
Will the Real Sword of Islam please stand up! Morteza read, rhetoric of hate, instigating bigotry, deliberate lies, fake Sword exposed. [4851 words]Sword of TruthApr 11, 2006 12:1742922
Sword of Truth, you did a great job!!!! [123 words]AnonymousApr 11, 2006 16:4242922
Sword of Truth, THANK YOU!!! [157 words]The Real Sword of IslamApr 11, 2006 18:0842922
true [81 words]RonnieApr 11, 2006 19:0142922
My fan club appears to be growing! [312 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 12, 2006 04:4342922
The Plastic Sword of Islam: Delusional [61 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 12, 2006 04:5042922
Ronnie [186 words]JustMeApr 12, 2006 11:3742922
Anonymous [13 words]JustMeApr 12, 2006 11:4142922
Yes JustMe [134 words]MuslimApr 12, 2006 17:4042922
The things we do for peace! [10750 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 12, 2006 18:1342922
The things we do for peace! [29 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 13, 2006 14:5242922
JustMe: Solidarity [122 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 13, 2006 15:2942922
Ronnie [31 words]Danish/AmericanApr 13, 2006 16:5442922
Justme [77 words]AnonymousApr 14, 2006 11:1742922
Muslim [106 words]JustMeApr 14, 2006 12:2642922
Sword of Truth, in re: Truth? [433 words]JustMeApr 15, 2006 13:3442922
Unity with eyes wide open [155 words]JustMeApr 15, 2006 23:1842922
Anonymous - [182 words]PCMadnessApr 17, 2006 21:3242922
2Anonymous, you call this compassion? [148 words]JustMeApr 18, 2006 12:4342922
The list has grown since then [52 words]fersusFeb 28, 2012 18:2142922
JustMe-Danish/American [186 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 8, 2006 19:1542747
2The Danish role during WW2..for those who don't know. [178 words]Danish/AmericanApr 10, 2006 07:2542747
Life is not just about potatoes and gravy... [538 words]SammyApr 5, 2006 19:0242487
Sammy ... [226 words]Sword of IslamApr 6, 2006 19:1642487
Sword of Islam [559 words]SammyApr 7, 2006 20:4642487
Goodbye, Sammy. [220 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 8, 2006 19:0442487
How Typical. [211 words]SammyApr 10, 2006 06:0042487
Sammy..question [208 words]Danish/AmericanApr 10, 2006 15:0242487
Sammy: Get Over It! [193 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 10, 2006 17:1342487
Answer for Danish/American [432 words]SammyApr 10, 2006 17:1342487
Danish/American, what is rotten in Denmark? [356 words]Adib FarakishApr 11, 2006 17:2142487
Sammy [531 words]Danish/AmericanApr 11, 2006 21:0942487
Adib Farakish [367 words]Danish/AmericanApr 12, 2006 06:3642487
" What are the little boys made of?" [268 words]Innocent MumApr 12, 2006 09:1842487
DanishAmerican [293 words]SammyApr 12, 2006 15:1242487
Danish/American [241 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 12, 2006 17:4642487
Sammy.. [363 words]Danish/AmericanApr 12, 2006 21:0242487
Innocent Mum [316 words]Danish/AmericanApr 12, 2006 21:1542487
For Danish/American regarding the Puppets [389 words]Adib FarakishApr 13, 2006 13:5042487
Sword of Islam & The Babies of Beslan on Sammy [27 words]Danish/AmericanApr 13, 2006 15:1842487
Sword of Beid and DanishAmerican [26 words]SammyApr 13, 2006 15:5242487
Sword and Danish/American - Rules of Engagement (Sammy Style) [208 words]JustMeApr 15, 2006 16:3742487
Adib Farakish [102 words]Danish/AmericanApr 16, 2006 00:5942487
Adib ... Now wash your hands! [382 words]PCMadnessApr 16, 2006 21:4242487
JustMe..Sammy style [65 words]Danish/AmericanApr 16, 2006 22:0742487
PC MadnessRe Adib [212 words]MandyApr 17, 2006 05:5942487
Sins of the flesh..... [151 words]PCMadnessApr 18, 2006 16:1842487
Of truth and playboy [357 words]nameApr 19, 2006 07:0342487
name [314 words]Danish/AmericanApr 19, 2006 15:5342487
Danish/American - lol [135 words]JustMeApr 19, 2006 16:1442487
name or no name.... it's rubbish! [1105 words]PCMadnessApr 19, 2006 16:5442487
name [248 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 19, 2006 17:2242487
Othello vs 'name' [190 words]Sword of Islam & The Babies of BeslanApr 19, 2006 19:2942487
Name Re Nudity in the West. [209 words]MandyApr 20, 2006 10:1942487
Nudists everywhere!! [64 words]JustMeApr 20, 2006 16:1342487
is this a rosie or oprah site ? [79 words]ronJun 30, 2007 17:2742487

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