69 million page views

The differences make the difference

Reader comment on item: A Madrasa Grows in Brooklyn
in response to reader comment: what if?

Submitted by David W. Lincoln (Canada), May 22, 2007 at 11:05

I don't like dealing with hypothetical situations, Susan. Frankly, thanks to the Jews, words such as progress and future came into being, and the Christian faith tradition advanced on such a foundation to go beyond what a right believing Jew would profess - but what lies beyond is also true. I do not see that being the case for the Muslims.

Case in point, two relatives of mine were backpacking through Greece and Turkey from mid June to mid July. One of the places they saw was the hagia Sophia cathedral. Ikons were defaced. Now, why would this be the case, because they would have known (if they had wanted to know) that venerating an ikon is not idol worship. Because the first sunday of lent is known as the Sunday of Orthodoxy, and it also celebrates the triumph of the ikon restorers. As you probably know, for a while ikons were not allowed in the Church, because it was incorrectly concluded that veneration of ikons was idol worship. Then what was made clear was the veneration of the ikon was the giving of honour to who was depicted on the ikon, rather than worshipping the wodd and paint used.

So, Susan, when you look at the other things that Moderate Muslims allow, that are the same as finger nails on a blackboard for those who want today better than yesterday (houses for Muslims cannot be lower than houses for those who adhere to other faith traditions, or no bell ringing, or a Muslim can force an adherant of another faith tradition to dismount when he, or she, is walking, et al.) leaving Islam is the best course available for those who are Muslim, as well for us who adhere to other faith traditions. Wafa Sultan makes the case of the backwardness of Islam, just like thoughtful people concluded that serfdom kept Russia from what could have been.

Dislike
Submitting....

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".

Submit a comment on this item

<< Previous Comment      Next Comment >>

Reader comments (179) on this item

Title Commenter Date Thread
Point of Disagreement [38 words]RobertDCMar 29, 2012 16:15194857
1Why not enroll your Jewish & Christian children? [288 words]AWBAug 14, 2007 15:23106211
this idea could help america [127 words]shaif yahyaJun 6, 2007 17:0096286
Communication [14 words]DennisOS2Jul 24, 2007 22:0396286
Yaya....Why not offer Arabic in any public school. [27 words]FroikeJan 27, 2009 13:0696286
Whom to believe ? Pipes or ADL ? [142 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
Gershon GoldsteenMay 26, 2007 22:5894710
You are afraid of people converting to Islam [145 words]Generation of TomorrowMay 19, 2007 18:0593656
1To Generation of Tomorrow (GoT): Islam brings me out in a cold sweat [502 words]PlatoMay 21, 2007 06:3493656
2Afraid of Islam! [293 words]Guy Leven-Torres (Agricola)May 23, 2007 16:4793656
support arab liberalism [56 words]samyJun 1, 2007 10:0293656
1Converting [150 words]joeyindcJun 7, 2007 20:3693656
about islam [182 words]alvinAug 26, 2007 23:1293656
It looks like you are afraid of Islam, maybe because it's the truth? [75 words]plusafJan 23, 2008 02:0293656
Afraid of Christianity and people like you ! [229 words]zashoApr 24, 2010 06:1993656
You are afraid of people converting to Islam [3 words]mmJul 3, 2012 11:3393656
Jelousies and poisonous by nature [155 words]KalamJun 25, 2018 06:2193656
Madrasa grown in Brooklyn [91 words]Lorie NewcombMay 16, 2007 13:2893248
the tolerance is the best drug [18 words]samyJun 1, 2007 10:0593248
1What could be more un-American than a culture-specific school? [221 words]James A. BridgeMay 16, 2007 12:1693216
Debbie seems genuine and right [224 words]ManavMay 5, 2007 03:2191690
reply to "debbie seems genuine and right". [112 words]romainMay 7, 2007 04:4991690
THE ISLAMIST MODEL [353 words]Robert ThomasMay 8, 2007 11:5391690
muslims want to take over [13 words]tabingins911May 13, 2007 01:1391690
Division not necessary [70 words]Anthony PerezMay 16, 2007 09:0291690
The Truth behind Madrassas ! An eye opener for all ! [128 words]VeerMay 4, 2007 10:3891642
NY Times suggests opening of the school will be postponed (5/4) [78 words]R. DavidsonMay 4, 2007 08:0291629
madrasa [39 words]jon purizhanskyMay 3, 2007 23:4191584
What about Christian Madrasas? [174 words]Muhammad Jesus MosesApr 30, 2007 00:2191087
Apples and Oranges [22 words]Constantine KipnisApr 30, 2007 14:0191087
You are 100% wrong [155 words]Bharat KhanApr 30, 2007 19:5391087
Why not? [140 words]Rodni E. ChaletMay 1, 2007 00:4091087
2boo hoo, you said it yourself [111 words]susanMay 1, 2007 14:1091087
I'm glad your curiousity was not punished. Some others aren't as lucky. [199 words]Constantine KipnisMay 1, 2007 17:1591087
Our dear Muhammad and his bogus Arabic [100 words]dhimmi no moreMay 2, 2007 18:2491087
Just one problem, Rodni [456 words]JeffMay 3, 2007 18:0591087
down with muslim madarsas [121 words]surjMay 7, 2007 17:1191087
wake up. [63 words]surjitMay 7, 2007 17:3491087
Madras in Brooklyn, NY [43 words]Ed Melik, Esq.May 14, 2007 12:1091087
My letter to Joel Klein, Chancellor of the New York Department of Education [704 words]Constantine KipnisApr 29, 2007 15:5391054
Are You Kidding? [71 words]Marlene BarryApr 28, 2007 17:1791028
No break [43 words]TerryApr 30, 2007 16:3591028
about madrasa [86 words]samApr 27, 2007 23:5590998
"Political Correctness" Gone Out of Control? [239 words]Judith CarpetApr 27, 2007 23:0590992
A Mahadrasha Grows in Brooklyn [194 words]MauriceApr 27, 2007 12:5690925
The opening of the Khalil Gibran International Academy [58 words]Nili BiondiApr 27, 2007 10:1390903
A Madrasa Grows in Brooklyn Art.No. 4441 [59 words]S.C.PandaApr 27, 2007 04:3790870
Are Americans naive! Is this a new Jihad training center, this time in USA! [212 words]Egyptian ChristianApr 26, 2007 10:5690734
Know Thine Enemy [590 words]Abu NuwasApr 26, 2007 09:5390726
dangerous [171 words]TerryApr 30, 2007 16:5090726
A Madrasa Grows in Brooklyn [28 words]David R.GroesbeckApr 26, 2007 04:3290698
Islam out of control [120 words]G.VishvasApr 26, 2007 01:3990686
Your vision & mission is to create friction and hate [163 words]Ravi JainApr 26, 2007 20:2390686
I agree with you 100%. [93 words]Egyptian ChristianApr 27, 2007 04:2290686
To Mr. "Jain" [294 words]G.VishvasApr 27, 2007 16:1590686
Venom [74 words]Frahad NavkhodaApr 30, 2007 04:3390686
To Frahad Jain [215 words]G.VishvasMay 1, 2007 06:3090686
You are right - G. Vishvas [154 words]JaladhiMay 1, 2007 22:2590686
Face of an extremist is like a multi-headed God [344 words]Frahad NavkhodaMay 2, 2007 05:2990686
Bravo Frahad [77 words]G.VishvasMay 3, 2007 03:4790686
2 Farhad "Christian Fundies give headache while Islamics cut the Head" [303 words]skmillerMay 3, 2007 10:3390686
Best commnets I ever seen! [70 words]Judeo ChrislamMay 7, 2007 01:0290686
That's a simple one... [179 words]Frahad NavkhodaJan 24, 2008 11:0390686
1Scrutiny, Awareness, education and debate [2471 words]IbbySep 12, 2010 18:0990686
stop the complaining [166 words]MuslimApr 25, 2007 22:5690679
to muslim [22 words]meApr 26, 2007 17:1990679
...more than 1400 years. [170 words]MuslimApr 26, 2007 23:1590679
to muslim (II) [158 words]G.VishvasApr 27, 2007 04:0390679
mollah [111 words]true believerApr 27, 2007 12:4190679
6Mr. Muslim, Aya 33.50 convinced me the truth of Islam [211 words]New muslimApr 27, 2007 17:1690679
to muslim [69 words]romainApr 27, 2007 22:1590679
Downfall of west. [114 words]surjApr 28, 2007 19:0590679
to Muslim re: Stop the complaining [355 words]BillApr 29, 2007 16:4290679
yeah, sure!! [106 words]JaladhiApr 30, 2007 09:3590679
Who was the first muslim? [215 words]morousMay 7, 2007 12:1690679
Education [172 words]Sam GreenAug 18, 2007 19:5790679
Wrong [26 words]RitaAug 4, 2012 13:3090679
The Land of the Free? [368 words]AvengerApr 25, 2007 21:3290658
Madrasa Grows In Brooklyn [73 words]AnthonyApr 25, 2007 19:0990644
My letter to Klein [193 words]dan w. taliaferroApr 25, 2007 19:0590642
Islamic Accademy in Brooklyn [149 words]Carol SolfronkApr 25, 2007 18:2990639
Don't Muslims pay Tax too? [26 words]Frahad NavkhodaApr 26, 2007 06:5090639
Reply to 3 questions by Muslim writer [232 words]Carol SolfronkApr 26, 2007 20:3690639
Reply to Frahad Navkhoda's questions [149 words]Romesh ChanderApr 26, 2007 22:2290639
Don't Catholics pay Tax too? [29 words]JeffApr 29, 2007 10:1090639
Dear J. K. Klein of New York City schools [152 words]ColinApr 25, 2007 17:5490634
western politicians are fools! [135 words]romainApr 25, 2007 19:3590634
One school out of many [38 words]Frahad NavkhodaApr 26, 2007 06:5390634
a constitutional issue [217 words]ajfestApr 25, 2007 15:3190623
ajfest [12 words]Carol SolfronkApr 25, 2007 19:4990623
"Separate" equals "Unequal" [19 words]James A. BridgeMay 16, 2007 12:3190623
My letter to Joel Klein [325 words]James VesceApr 25, 2007 15:1590620
Madrassas in America [17 words]Cecil DonahoApr 25, 2007 14:5890619
When will the USA learn appeasement doesn't work [327 words]Cheri HuntApr 25, 2007 13:2290608
totally agree [95 words]TerryApr 27, 2007 15:5590608
Madrasas have long been present in Canada... [356 words]J.S.Apr 25, 2007 13:1990607
So Many Questions [256 words]PatApr 25, 2007 11:4190602
Why Gibran? [31 words]Pekka SurellatApr 25, 2007 10:4690601
Gibran background non Musim [119 words]Dwight BrownApr 25, 2007 14:5690601
Dear Mr. Klein - Incomplete deNazification [93 words]Norman WandApr 25, 2007 08:4890597
Be efficient : be primitive. [177 words]Raymond31Apr 25, 2007 07:1390593
Learn the Lessons of History [68 words]SinghaApr 25, 2007 01:2790568
Alarm bells are ringing [38 words]Rajunov SinghMay 10, 2007 06:3090568
US Taxpayer Supported Madrasas.... [90 words]Domenic PepeApr 25, 2007 01:0690566
An Interesting (?) Name for this School ? [37 words]Stevan Dweck, Ph.D.Apr 25, 2007 01:0290564
No accident... [75 words]donvanApr 26, 2007 16:0490564
Amen! [66 words]Stevan Dweck, Ph.D.Apr 26, 2007 19:5190564
What did you expect -- call it Bin Laden Academy [71 words]Romesh ChanderApr 26, 2007 22:0790564
Embracing the best culture, not "multiculturalism" [321 words]Caesar M. ArevaloApr 25, 2007 00:5390563
Love the title of this article... [167 words]Richard HouseApr 25, 2007 00:4290562
Vouchers: another casualty in the war on terror [253 words]Stuart FaginApr 24, 2007 23:3190559
Who abuses madrasas? [434 words]Bharat KhanApr 24, 2007 23:1690558
Turkish solution [62 words]David W. LincolnApr 24, 2007 22:5890557
and in spite of this [87 words]susanMay 1, 2007 14:4890557
Lighting a candle [105 words]David W. LincolnMay 1, 2007 19:2790557
a totally different story [160 words]susanMay 2, 2007 16:2690557
What can be redeemed? [184 words]David W. LincolnMay 2, 2007 19:1290557
what you greatly miss [233 words]susanMay 3, 2007 18:1290557
Working with what is [65 words]David W. LincolnMay 5, 2007 12:0490557
progress and turkey should not be placed in the same sentence [197 words]susanMay 5, 2007 18:2090557
Where we need to go to from here [237 words]David W. LincolnMay 6, 2007 20:1590557
not the smartest starting point [274 words]susanMay 7, 2007 17:1890557
Once more, from the beginning [167 words]David W. LincolnMay 8, 2007 10:3490557
you're taking the longest path [217 words]susanMay 9, 2007 06:0690557
Limited vision [180 words]David W. LincolnMay 9, 2007 19:0690557
4china is a great civilization, no matter what [161 words]susanMay 11, 2007 06:0290557
Perspective [254 words]David W. LincolnMay 11, 2007 23:5890557
again ignorance of the basics of history [384 words]susanMay 13, 2007 08:5290557
Touchy aren't we... [107 words]David W. LincolnMay 14, 2007 10:3990557
Some observations [163 words]David W. LincolnMay 14, 2007 12:2390557
no idea of what real politik is [127 words]susanMay 15, 2007 15:4490557
Why do you look at the speck ... [184 words]susanMay 15, 2007 15:5090557
Cui bono? [54 words]David W. LincolnMay 16, 2007 08:5290557
Papist-Caesaroism in other words? [187 words]David W. LincolnMay 16, 2007 09:0790557
who is doing more brigandage? [101 words]susanMay 16, 2007 16:2090557
relativism never works [78 words]susanMay 16, 2007 16:4190557
A different path [61 words]David W. LincolnMay 17, 2007 14:1990557
Combatting evil [35 words]David W. LincolnMay 17, 2007 14:2290557
that's an entirely different situation [123 words]susanMay 17, 2007 17:2090557
wishful thinking [60 words]susanMay 17, 2007 17:2190557
Stick to script [172 words]David W. LincolnMay 19, 2007 12:4790557
Clarification [72 words]David W. LincolnMay 19, 2007 12:5090557
what if? [80 words]susanMay 21, 2007 08:1590557
not a smart comparison [55 words]susanMay 21, 2007 08:1990557
With clarity and more words [316 words]David W. LincolnMay 22, 2007 10:5090557
The differences make the difference [318 words]David W. LincolnMay 22, 2007 11:0590557
whatever you think you have made clearer [51 words]susanMay 24, 2007 04:4290557
Clarity and resolve [90 words]David W. LincolnMay 25, 2007 23:0690557
I hope there doesn't become a need for High School and Grammar School Campus Watch! [140 words]larryApr 24, 2007 22:1390551
bravo for Multicultural curriculum! [28 words]Elizabeth Ross, MDApr 24, 2007 21:1390547
A Madrasa in Brooklyn [114 words]Roberto VicencioApr 24, 2007 21:0890546
Muslim Schools in America [125 words]Iftikhar AhmadMay 16, 2007 10:4990546
Schools not for terrorist [85 words]KalamJun 25, 2018 08:4990546
Muslim Schools in America [727 words]Iftikhar AhmadJun 25, 2018 17:0890546
Questions for our dear Iftikhar Ahmad (PBUH aka صلى الله عليه وسلم) [272 words]dhimmi no moreJun 27, 2018 06:0290546
More questions for our dear Iftikhar Ahma صلى الله عليه وسلم and the "Muslim rapes of non Muslim girls and women" [114 words]dhimmi no moreJun 27, 2018 06:2190546
More questions for our dear Iftikhar Ahma صلى الله عليه وسلم and "Farting" in Islam! No I'm not joking! [122 words]dhimmi no moreJun 27, 2018 06:3490546
Our dear Iftikhar Ahmad صلى الله عليه وسلم why not move to Saudi Arabia? [252 words]dhimmi no moreJun 27, 2018 07:5590546
The victory of Arabs in America [75 words]f.shaApr 24, 2007 20:2990543
Abandoning Arabic in favour of English [79 words]R K IyerMay 12, 2007 11:2290543
great that you have a plan but [15 words]susanMay 14, 2007 14:5590543
Time to put cameras in classrooms. [125 words]paratisiApr 24, 2007 20:2390541
Dear Mayor Bloomberg [604 words]Irene AlterApr 24, 2007 19:1390538
Written well [17 words]KatJun 11, 2007 09:1790538
Arabic Schools in US pose danger [82 words]TennismanApr 24, 2007 18:1790534
State Education Requirements [162 words]Frank K. HooverApr 24, 2007 17:3390522
Jihad Factory in New York!!! [172 words]Romesh ChanderApr 24, 2007 16:0990514
Love them "Hand Outs" [26 words]Joe Schmoe USAApr 24, 2007 14:3390510
Arabic and anti-Semitism [215 words]R K IyerApr 25, 2007 02:2290510
A Jewish teacher meeting their standards [24 words]O. FelmanovaApr 25, 2007 11:5890510
shout from the tallest building [63 words]syed mohammad aliApr 29, 2007 13:2690510
2racism and communication [275 words]moderate Muslim 1May 5, 2007 13:1290510
some clarifications [349 words]susanMay 5, 2007 18:3390510
Arabs and Arabic have an image problem [292 words]RamakrishnanMay 6, 2007 06:0590510
To Moderate muslim1: Lucky you! [971 words]PlatoMay 9, 2007 07:2490510
Too much detail [91 words]DennisOS2Jul 24, 2007 22:3390510
Arabs are Semitic people too [9 words]tuxedoJul 27, 2008 23:3590510
A doomed mission [62 words]Yuval Brandstetter MDApr 24, 2007 12:4790503
Exactly [59 words]BlackspeareApr 24, 2007 19:5490503
Brava Irene Alter. [86 words]Maura CollinsApr 27, 2007 20:2790503

Follow Daniel Pipes

Facebook   Twitter   RSS   Join Mailing List

All materials by Daniel Pipes on this site: © 1968-2024 Daniel Pipes. daniel.pipes@gmail.com and @DanielPipes

Support Daniel Pipes' work with a tax-deductible donation to the Middle East Forum.Daniel J. Pipes

(The MEF is a publicly supported, nonprofit organization under section 501(c)3 of the Internal Revenue Code.

Contributions are tax deductible to the full extent allowed by law. Tax-ID 23-774-9796, approved Apr. 27, 1998.

For more information, view our IRS letter of determination.)