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The Hijazi Arabs invasion of the Middle East

Reader comment on item: From Time Immemorial
in response to reader comment: The Arab population of Palestine were native in all the usual senses of that word.

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), Jul 17, 2014 at 07:58

Our dear Sus does not seem to be aware that there were Arab tribes in the Levant and Mesopotamia prior to the Arab invasion of the Middle East in 633CE and they were Christian and they spoke Aramaic as well as some form of Arabic which was a hybrid of Arabic and Aramaic and they wrote their documents by using the Syriac script (Garshouni which is really Arabic written by using the Syriac alphabet) they also used Syriac and yes there are very few Arabic texts that predate Islam. These Arab tribes were forced to convert to islam not right away but some 200 years after the Arab invasion (and why not right away? the answer here is because islam did not exist this early on) and once this took place their link to Aramaic was lost and this is indeed why the Ulama had no clue about the Aramaic in the Qur'an or what it means

To the historian the answer is obvious. A small contingent of Arabs from Arabia did indeed conquer the country in the seventh century.

This is very true because the importation of Hijazi Arabs to places like Egypt and the Levant was very limited

But as a result of factors which were briefly outlined in the first chapter of this book, the Palestinian population soon became Arabized under Arab domination,

Well then Rodison is saying that indeed the invading Arabs forced the real inhabitants to abandon their languegs be it Aramaic or Hebrew or Armenian and become Arabic speakers but we know that a language is very central to a culture which means that the invading Arabs destroyed the native culture and they also forced the local population to convert to Islam

just as earlier it had been Hebraicized, Aramaicized, to some degree

But the Jews and those that spoke Aramaic never forced others to speak their languages and never forced others to convert to Christianity or Judiasm

even Hellenized.

Again he is wrong. Hellenism was unique because it was really a phenomenon of the cities and not of the country side and if let us say an Egyptian wanted to be Hellenized he moved to Alexandria and this is why in the case of Egypt the language of Egypt did not die because no one was forced to speak Greek or to become Greek

Hellenism was a cultural phenomenon that was transmitted in Greek and no was forced to join

He is very wrong

Now compare this with the Arabs and their imperialism where the native population was forced to adopt the Arabic language instead of their native language and many converted to Islam in-order to avoid the Jizya and Kharaj tax which ruined the economy of Egypt within 100 years after the Arab invasion in 642CE

Rodison is wrong again

Now compare this with Persia where the people of Iran were dragged in Islam and many of them had no like for the Arabs or their imperialism and they regared their culture as far superior to the culture of the Arabs but in typical Persian way "If you cannot beat them then join them" and this is indeed what happened as Iranians created what Islam is all about (70% of the books of early Islam were written by Persians the likes of al-Tabari and Ibn Saad and not by Arabs) but what saved the poeple of Iran and the culture of Iran and the language of Iran from the Arabs and their cultural imperialism must have been Fardawsi and his Shahnamah and the power or nationalism and secular culture

Compare this with Egypt which is the only other nation state in the Middle East and if the Copts had similar secular literature the likes of the Shahnamah Egyptians would been speaking their native language today and not Arabic. Egypt to this day and if we believe what Gason Weits claim that 92% of Egyptians have their roots in Egypt and have nothing to do with the Hijaz

It became Arab in a way that it was never to become Latinized

Not really even the Qur'an has loan words from Latin via Syriac the likes of al-Sarat in Surat al-Fatiha and the archeticture made it to Arabic archeticture and Roman Law made it to Islamic law

I'm shocked that a great historian like him still believe in the bogus claim by the Arabs of al-Jahiliyya when in actual fact there is no historical discontinuity

or Ottomanized.

The Arabs never liked the Turks and yes they are Muslims but they did not speak the language of Allah which is the language of the Arabs but the Turks also left their marks in the spoken Arabic of today which has many loan words from Turkish as well as the so called Arabic cuisine has much in it that is Turkish

The invaded melted with the invaders.

Well he is wrong again because you would expect that the barbarian or invader will melt away and become part of the civilized in other words the invading Arabs should have been Aramaic speakers in Palestine and Coptic speakers in Egypt and they would have converted to Christianity but the opposite happened and why is that? The only explanation is that at the time of the Arab invasion the civilized Middle East was in the process of change that we still do not understand and the invading Arabs (the polity) came upon a new religion (Islam) that was being formed not in Arabia but in the civilized Middle East and the Arabs had to look back and find a prophet and a cultic center and it was all made up later on after all how can you explain the fact that you will not find the name of Muhammad in the very early Arabic language extant sources

Most damaging to the early Arab historians is that we are told that 4000 Arabs invaded Egypt and the real question is how can 4000 looters invaded and conquer a country of 7 millions with a very powerful army unless the Arabs by accident were the catalyst for such change and how could 4000 ignorant nomads from Arabic change a very profound old civilization the likes of Egypt

There is never simple answers in history and beware of historians that provide simple answers

Submitting....

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Reader comments (53) on this item

Title Commenter Date Thread
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1a linguistic question [149 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
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2News Archives Support Joan Peters [139 words]cwSep 14, 2013 20:08209748
1Palestine historically recognized already in the 19th century in South america [156 words]MikeJun 22, 2012 02:04196523
2So what, the visas were stamped by the British. There was no Palesistinian Govt. There were only occupants of a territory. [218 words]SilverWolfFeb 26, 2015 21:27196523
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29More on Arab immigrants, So called "Palestinians". When they started to flood Palestine as Jews changed and cultivated the vacant land [7928 words]RobertaFeb 8, 2011 02:03182419
3The Arab population of Palestine were native in all the usual senses of that word. [274 words]susJul 16, 2014 11:01182419
4The Hijazi Arabs invasion of the Middle East [1051 words]dhimmi no moreJul 17, 2014 07:58182419
1Still in the XI cent. Palestine had a Christian majority. The "forced conversion" is historically inaccurate. [295 words]SusAug 16, 2014 15:51182419
4Justifying Arabian imperialism [733 words]dhimmi no moreAug 18, 2014 07:59182419
3Guiding the perplexed and victims of Arabian imperialism [269 words]dhimmi no moreAug 18, 2014 17:31182419
1remember to go to London to explain to the English people that they are invaders and occupiers. Just for coherence. [252 words]SusAug 20, 2014 09:14182419
4Islam was spread by the sword and the battle of Ullais is Mesopotamia in 633CE [301 words]dhimmi no moreAug 20, 2014 17:36182419
1Video in arabic you might enjoy [35 words]saraAug 20, 2014 20:44182419
2Arabian imperialism and its victims [597 words]dhimmi no moreAug 21, 2014 07:44182419
1They have no shame [54 words]dhimmi no moreAug 21, 2014 08:11182419
5More evidence that Islam was spread by the sword and this time the Amazigh [528 words]dhimmi no moreAug 21, 2014 12:11182419
4Allah says in the Qur'an that Palestine is the Jewish promised land and that the Jews and it is not the land of the Palestinians [506 words]dhimmi no moreAug 23, 2014 13:28182419
khalid ibn waleed [85 words]abduMar 15, 2015 15:48182419
1Our dear Abdu al-tablighee and his 15 minutes of fame [304 words]dhimmi no moreMar 17, 2015 08:54182419
Information very misleading. [27 words]Joanna ClaytonApr 26, 2015 10:30182419
3its my list ! :) [861 words]stern ilan israelMay 5, 2015 12:37182419
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4Government of Israel first duty is to protect the people at all costs, not run their lives. [539 words]YJ DraimanNov 14, 2017 15:54182419
3Thank you Mr. Draiman for bringing up the 1 Million Jew's who lived in the Middle East [552 words]YJ DraimanDec 10, 2017 19:19182419
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2Hanifa's argument is not comprehensible [109 words]PrashantMar 12, 2019 21:19182419
2Imagine my shock! Our dear Hanifa is saying that Islam was spread by the sword! [94 words]dhimmi no moreMar 22, 2019 13:57182419
Resources on the so-called "Palestinians"- AKA the Arab immigrants to Israel [566 words]JacksonSep 21, 2022 16:30182419
1funding for the book [55 words]jacobOct 12, 2010 13:00179194
1JORDYPTIANS A.K.A. ARAB "PALESTINIANS" [1165 words]IleneJun 9, 2010 18:04174139
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2ARABIZATION INC. The all out myth of 'all Arabs being natives in all of the middle east' [974 words]AlJan 12, 2007 02:5872490
3Zionists despised the natives [92 words]Tom RawlinsonSep 10, 2006 07:5155418
early Zionists [64 words]SurvivorOct 6, 2006 10:2455418
Resettling the Jews [40 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
S. F. AdefajoJul 20, 2006 14:2650330
A grateful fan of yours [31 words]Seymour KoenigNov 7, 2005 23:3627922
What is one to think? [22 words]AnonymousAug 22, 2005 06:5724956
5The Positive Side of Joan Peter's "From Time Immemorial [170 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
Nadene GoldfootDec 3, 2003 21:1012465
6Joan Peters thesis would be irrelevant even if it was genuine. [198 words]Andy DyerNov 22, 2006 12:4512465
5Something missing from your otherwise excellent review. [267 words]sheldon kalmutzFeb 25, 2007 23:3112465
9palestine [181 words]majdi al-masriDec 13, 2008 23:5712465
9WHO IS OCCUPYING WHOM [157 words]BEN-DAVID MEIRMay 4, 2010 15:0112465
5history what! no joseph no moses no david no soloman no dead sea scrolls no herod no jesus the jew [102 words]tiviotSep 25, 2010 14:2312465
5Wrong, Wrong, and Wrong Again [258 words]Hanna GJul 5, 2012 20:4712465
book [7 words]smithDec 21, 2012 14:4612465

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