Mohammed's Response to 'NoDhimmi'

Submitted by Mohammed (United States), Jul 28, 2005 at 06:23

No Dhimmi said:

" Dhimmitude in Islamic Law means the protected non Muslims in the Islam land"
You are relegating a group of people to second-class citizenship. It imposes unreasonable and discriminatory limitations on those individuals. In addition, the jizya is nothing but extortion. If you don't pay, you could lose your life.

Reply:

Not second Class Citizens. Muslims pay Zakat and Non Muslims pay Gezia. Gezia is for Protection. If the Muslims are not able to protect the Non Muslims then they do not pay gezia. Gezia is imposed on the Non Muslim men only who make money. Not on women or children or Clergy men. To say the man whop refuse to pay is to die is a lie. The Islam Government may just impose fine on the man. From where do you being this information? Show me from the Qur'an and the Prophet Orders a single line saying the Non Muslims die if they do not pay Gezia.

In addition, show me one thriving Jewish or Christian community where Islam is dominant. Let's take a look.

Reply:
You are making great mistake. Tell me where in the Qur'an or the Prophets orders one line saying Non Muslims are to live in law level, ... Now: What is your sources of information? It is not right to just quote the New York Times or the Wall Street journal, ...
In Malaysia, forget getting good government jobs if you are a non-muslim or teaching Christianity in Christians schools because it is forbidden. Bibles must be stamped with the words "NOT FOR MUSLIMS" on the cover. Oh by the way, the non-muslims pay the jizya.

The European Christians came to the Islamic Land. They arrested all the Islamic Scholars in Indonesia, Malysia, Philipine, ... They shipped these people to Africaa. The Islam faith may disappear if the Islam scholars are gone. The Europeans then send their Clergy with Rice and help then convert the vulnerable muslims to Christianity. Should not the Muslims protect themselves? The Christians never go to the Debate and show us what they know about even their own Bible. Look at Philippines now: It became Catholic and the Muslims in the South are treated like dogs and animals. The Christians converted in Indonisia 10 millions and they are trying harder. We Muslims, seeing the illegal methods of the Christians must protect ourselves. That is why we should stamp the Bible to protect our kids and ignorant poor population. In addition: this is not islamic orders: These are methods used to protect the Muslims from the Church men.

In Indonesia, there is a law prohibiting the printing of the Bible in the native language and don't forget the governments complacency and culpability in the massacres of Christians in East Timor.

Read the above. If you want to talk about Faith: Come for the debate. The West sends the Bible then convert the ignorant then send his fleets and occupy the Muslim lands.

You say:
Let's move on to Sudan and the genocide that has been perpetrated by the Islamic Government. Millions of Christians and Animists in the South have been slaughter or taken as slaves and forced to convert to Islam. If you doubt me, read the Boston Globe article on the subject from 1998 or 1999.

Reply:
False: Sudan's Dictator Nomairy, hired and protected by the Western Politicians lost support. he wanted to gain support of his own people. :He applied Islamic Shareea Laws. Muslims have all the right to apply Islam laws so they protect the society. Muslim thief is to be penalized by his hand cut off. Christian thief is to be treated same. What is wrong with that?

Why should Muslims ignore their holy Book code of punishment and adopt the Non Muslims code of Justice? The Christian Minority in the South Declared war. They killed and committed all crimes against Muslims. The West supported the Rebels with all weapons. During the war many many people died. is this the fault of islam? It was the South who declared war and got guns from the West. What should Muslims do? In addition you made a mistake: Please read to the other side then come to conclusion. Who said that Boston Globe has the Truth?

You say:
Moving onto Nigeria. Sharia is being imposed in the North and Christians are being forced to abide by it. A mentally ill young man walks into a mosque and tears a page from the Quran. Because he is not muslim, it is assumed he is a Christian. The muslims go on a rampage and kill 300 Christians and burn Churches. Mohammed, Christians do not want to live under islamic law. IF YOU WANT PEACE, DON'T IMPOSE IT ON US. IF YOU DO, THERE WILL BE NO PEACE.

Reply: You do not understand what is imposed on Non Muslims. I am a Muslim and I live in the West. The Non Muslim Laws are imposed on me. The Government here applies the Non Muslim laws on everyone. Who is to say then the Islam law must be imposed on me? This is misunderstanding! The majority rule and the minority and majority have to abide by the same law applied on both sides. Christians in Nigeria killed huge number of Muslims. All Nigeria was Muslim. The British came and converted many to Christianity and gave them land and power. If a Christian shows disrespect to the Qur'an there must be a penalty. If some burn and kill Christians for disrepecting or tearing the Qur'an this is not Islamic laws. You must understand also that islam laws punishs Muslims from burning or tearing the Bible. If both sides in Nigeria kill and do wrong against each other, please do not blame Islam.

Do you like Muslims in France to say: We do not like to live under the Non Muslim laws in France? This does not make sense. The majority rule and the law is applied on both sides. Peace comes when everyone respect the law and the minority accept the right of the majority to rule. If Islam cuts off the hand of the Non Muslim thief hand and sends to jail the Muslim thief then u have all the right to condemn this. Only thiefs and killers must fear islam law and they will live in peace if they do not kill or steal.

You say:
Let's see Palestine. Members of Hamas have a gun battle with Israeli forces in 2002. They take refuge in the Church of the Nativity. Over five days, they desecrate the Church, urinating and defecating in corners. They use pages from the Bible as toilet paper. They get drunk off the wine used during the Eucharistic celebration. Pews are smashed, windows broken.

Reply: In the first place Palestine is a Muslim country with 90% majority until 1910. The British occupied the land and declared Balfour Promise.

The plan is to create a Jewish majority country even if the price is to convert the people there to refugees. The British killed 30,000 Palestininas before the forties. The Zionist completed the job and now there are 6 million Palestinian Refugees out of their home Land. You should call for the return of all the Refugees back. The Jews and Christians can live as minorities in the land of Islam.

What is wrong with that? Muslims live in USA and Europe as minorities. What is wrong with that? Now sir: The Israelies are surrounding the Church. The Palestinains are inside. Whatever happens against the Church or its holy books then is a temporary actions. This is not Islam: Did the Muslims in the 7th century ever burn churches like the Ugly Serbs did to the Mosques in Bosnia or Kosovo? The Serbs were Victorious and they did their crimes. Muslims when they were Victorious they never did this garbage. Ask yopurself how did the Mideast, Indonisia and the far east became Muslims? How did one man: Mohammed The Prophet, succeed to have 1.8 Billion people Muslims now? Why is 9islam the number one spreading faith everywhere including Europe and America? Ask yourself anf then answer. You must listen to both sides about what happened in the Church at that time and remember that the Zionist Army was surrounding the Church and keeps killing the resistance men inside. Why cannot the Refugees come back and live in palestine and rule the minority Jews and Christians? Is not this Justice? Show me one single word in the Qur'an saying do so or so in the Churches or in the Prophet orders.

You say:
Guards at Gitmo have to wear gloves if they touch the Qur'an. I didn't hear an apology from Mr. Arafat or the leader of Hamas. If such a thing happened in a mosque, there would be dead people all around because muslims are offended.

Reply: Who orderede them to do so? It is the US Government. Now do the Guards respect this Qur'an? Do they know what did this Quran do to the Humanity? Do they know that this Qur'an invaded the hearts of 1.8 Billion people Do they know this book made the weak Arabs the masters of Humanity by their great civilization? Do they know that this Qur'an still invades hearts and gain converts each day? I wish the US Government will allow people who know History to tell these Guards and these Americans what is this book and what did it do to Humanity. Tell me how come the Qur'an did make the Arabs who used to fear the Byzantine and Persians wipe their armies and rule their vast land then over 95 % of the MidEast people became Muslims. How did this happen? Ask yourself and answer.

You say:
Then there is Pakistan. Why does a country that is over 95% muslim need laws against blaspheming against the Qur'an, Mohammed, or Islam? Muslims would never think of doing it. Muslims would not even question whether the Qur'an is truly from God given it's errors i.e. sperm comes from a rib in your back. After dissecting two human bodies during my medical education, I can tell you without a doubt that spermatic cord does not exit the back, thus no sperm from the back.

Reply: The Prophet of islam ordered the Muslims to do so. If Muhammad is the Prophet of God and if Islam is the religion chosen by God to all Humanity is not natural to protect the Muslims from some ugly man who may be able to reverse all what islam did? If a Muslim man decided to convert and started getting money from the Church then later guns from some western or Eastern Non Muslim country, will not this lead to what happened in Philippine? The Muslims now are minority and they live like dogs and animals.

After the Death of the Prophet what happened: Some powerful men decided to declare themselves Prophets and some refused to pay Zakat. If Abu Bakr, the best Muslim after the Prophet decided to leave them alone, what could have happened: Islam would have died. Abu Bakr sent Strong Muslims and with ratio one to 7, Muslims won decisively. These leaders will all killed in the battle field. The People realized they were deceived. They came back to the true Islam. With these people Islam went east and west, North and South gaining the 1.8 Billion you know now on this planet!

Please understand the story from the beginning. Do not ask the Muslims but to follow their faith orders by the Qur'an or by the Prophet Muhammad otherwise you are asking for the impossible. Now tell me: In israel, a Jewish man was working in the Nuclear Industry. He decided to be Christian. He told the world about the secrets of the Nuclear Reactor in israel. The Israel Government kidnapped the man and sent him 18 years in Prison. the man cannot leave Isreal now. Did not they do this to protect their Interest? Think. How does Muslim Governments protect their interests? What do you want the Muslims to do if somebody in pakistan does burn the Qur'an or insult the Prophet of Islam? Should they say thank you? If they do not punish such a man, he may bring money from a Church donations in USA. he may start attacking the Prophet and deceive the ignorant Muslims in pakistan. Later the armies of the Non Muslims will invade to protect the Christian minority there and Pakistans Muslims wil pay the price. That is why Muslims must protect themselves. There is long history of plots against islam! There are no errors in the Qur'an. Do not interpret the Qur'an wrong then hold Muslims responsible for your wrong interpretition. If you really want to prove the Qur'an is not God's word, write one like it. The Qur'an states that if all the Creatures decided to write a book like the Qur'an they will fail even if they all cooperate together. Did you ever read for an American, French, german, Christian Copt, ..... that he is accepting the Challenge? Please think about this point: Why do they all refuse even to mention this verse? They do because they know they are not able and they will never be able to do that! They are afraid to say thay are too weak to produce a book like it. Since this is the case, then it is afact that the Qur'an is the direct word of God. How come an educated man like you does not understand this simple fact: islam is true. the Prophet said the truth and many powerful people at that time prosecuted him and they at the end came to the logical conclusion that islam is true and the Qur'an is the direct word of God.

So why the law? Because it is used against minorities like Christians, Sikhs, and Hindus. If you have a grudge or a disagreement with one of them, then all a muslim has to do is accuse him of insulting Islam and he gets his revenge and maybe more i.e. land. You had better hope that a mob doesn't form or you could be killed like the elder gentleman who was illiterate and told by his employer to burn some papers. A passer-by thought it was pages from the Qur'an and told his neighbors. They decended on the elderly man and beat him to death. No charges have been filed because the life of a non-muslim is not as valuable as a muslim. If you don't believe me, look it up in "Reliance of the Traveler." It is the text of Islamic Law approved by Al-Azhar.

Reply: Read the above. The law is to avoid getting pakistan the same fate of Philippines. Did you read the History of Philipine and its Muslim people? Did you realize how did the Non Muslims treat Muslims after occupying their lands? Islam never approve if a Muslim accuses Non Muslims with false charges. In any country on earth if there is corrupt Policeman, he can hide some drugs in your home and get you arrested and being sentenced to life in Prision. Islam is not to be blamed. If Pakistan is ruled by an islamic Scholar all of the wrong which takes place will never happen. Muslims are ruled by ugly dictatoprs and many wrong things happen and Islam is not to be blamed. In Iran, Scholars rule Iran and such wrong practices do not take place.

You say:
Then there is Egypt. The Coptic Christians have been targets of discrimination and killing for hundreds of years. A new practice is telling Coptic girls that they have won a prize for being at the store that day. They go in the back and sign a paper that will give them their prize. What is really happening is they sign a document that really says that they are converting to Islam. The girl is then taken from her family and forced to marry a muslim man. It doesn't stop there. It takes a decree from President Mubark to allow renovations or repairs to existing Churches. This goes back to dhimmitude in Sharia. Hmm..........the Vatican lets Saudi Arabia build a mosque near it but Christians in Egypt can't repair their Churches.

Reply: Copts are 5 to 6 percent (Read the CIA records) they own 40 to 60 percent of the money in Egypt. They have better education. They have better jobs. Islam never called for the killing of Non Muslims. When a fight happenes between a Muslim family and Christian family, the others join and sometimes many die. This is not delibrate plan to kill Christians. If the Islam Scholars rule Egypt, the Muslims will learn islam right and no such incidents happen. Copts sell to Muslims but they buy from each other. Copts rent apartments to Copts and Muslims rent to everyone. If Muslims organize themselves and decide not to buy from Copts or not to hire Copts, the Copts will be hungry and they will never own 40 to 60 % of the wealth of the nation. Islam gains from 50 to 80 thousand converts each year in Egypt. The Copts are theones who wrote this in their home page. They go and tell the people in the West wrong stories with no proof! This is propaganda. Are the Copts ready to prove their charges? Do not accept anything till having the chance for the other party to defend himself. Copts have enough room in their churches to pray. Should Muslims allow copts to build churches just to have the churches, their huge money will convert Egyptian cities to Churches. Else remember: islam loves and respects Jesus and the Copts slander the Prophet of Islam. When this happenes Muslims become very angry. If the Christians see Jews slandering Jesus they will be also angry. Read the Copts Home Page and see how far they slander the Prophet of Islam. Do you approve that? What do you expect the Muslims to do in response?

You say:
Let's look at Iran. Well what can we say. They kill everyone, communists (Khomenei), socialists (Khomenei), Bahai's (Khomenei), Adhammiyas (Khomenei). They stone a mentally ill 16 year old girl who is sold by her mother into prostitution or women accused of "inappropriate contact with a man," excuse me but where are the 4 witnesses? Christians, Jews and Bahia are discriminated against in employment, education, and religous practices. Let's not forget the Ayatollah Khomenei said it was ok to have sex with a child as long as you didn't hurt her.

Reply: The above is not true. Send a letter to the Iranian embassy in UN and get the answer then ask neutral sources. I read the New York times each day and what u tell me is not there. On applying Islam laws, ask the woman who commits adultery before asking the Muslim Government why do they excute those who commit adultery or prostitution. If Islam allows people to sleep around, Islam then will disppear. is;am continues only if being applied. Do not ask mjuslims to adopt Non Muslim laws since then you are asking them not to be Muslims. Blame Rushdie for slandering the Prophet of Islam before blaming the Muslims to be angry. If you slander the Jews saying the Holocaust is a lie, you will never have a job in USA Universities, ... Why is that? If u deny the Holcaust in germany or France, you go to jail: Why is that. If you slander Prophet Muhammad, what should the Muslims do?

You say:
The best is left for last. Saudi Arabia. Muslims complain about a few incidents of the Qur'an being miss handled or desecrated. I think it is wrong to mistreat or violate anyone's holy text. But, everyday Bibles and religous articles are confiscated from people entering Saudi Arabia. The crosses or religous medalions are destroyed and the Bibles are burned. Currently, there are 40 Pakistani Christians sitting in a Saudi jail for such a terrible, subversive, and evil thing as PRAYING TO THEIR GOD. The punishment for such activities is flogging and if you tried to share your faith with a muslim, you could be executed. And to think I was told Islam is a religion of peace and tolerance??

Reply: Saudi Arabia is not Islam. Egypt allows Christians and Bibles. So blame Saudi Leaders and Do Not blame Islam. Also remember that Muslims are afraid from Christians. They start by saying let us pray in Saudi Arabia then they say let us build churches then Saudi Arabia will be come like Philipine. The Muslims have the Crusades experience. It makes them fear oneday, Christians will do to Mecca and Median what they did to Jerusalem in 1099. Do you have gurantees what was done in 1099 will never happen again?

You say: One last thing, if the Andalus was such a wonderful paradise under Islamic rule, then why did the Spaniards spend 700 years working to expell the muslims?

Reply: Because they are fanatics. They know that many Muslims were there in 1492 and they know they will fail peacefully to make them become Catholics. For this reason they made the Spanish Enqusitions and killed hundreds of thousands to wipe Islam off Spain. What they did is criem against Humanity. islam does not do this. In short time the Mideast people accepted the new faith and changed their langauage. Have you herad the word Islamic enquisitions in History books?

You say:
Mohammed, you talk about what France and Britian did to the middle east. It is no different than what the muslim armies did when they invaded and took over North Africa, the Middle East, South Asia and into Eastern Europe. You want Britian and France to atone for their "sins" of colonialism? What about Islam's sin of "Religious Colonialsim?"

Reply: Wrong. Britain and France failed to make Muslims become Christians and so they did the ugliest things ever: They created 22 countries out of one. They brought dictators to rule Muslims. They fight Islam night and day. They fight applying Muslim Qur'anic Laws in the Muslim lands. islam did not touch a church. Come to Egypt and see churches built 500 years before Prophet Muhamad was born. Did Islam cut countries and hire dictators to rule the British or French? Read about Islam civilization in Spain. Did Muslims create border and restrict the movement of people or trade? The British and French did. Islam has no sins. islam defeated armies much more in number and weapons. Islam treated the people same like Muslims except they pay small Gezia and Muslims pay Zakat. Islam also prevented the Christians from spreading Christianity or any faith else between Muslims. This is natural: Islam believes in the Prophets of Judaism and in Jesus. Jews deny the Prophethood of Muhammad and Jesus. Christians deny the Prophethood of Muhammad and they work by any means to wipe out Islam from earth. Ask yourself why does Islam spread between the Americans and Europeans and please tell me the answer.Please first ask some Muslims Converts why did they convert.

No Dhimmi: Read what is the definition of Dhimmi according to Islam's Scholars books, please.

Mohammed

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