no hatred involved.

Submitted by the Grand Infidel of Kafiristan (Australia), Dec 6, 2009 at 15:43

Sufi muslim, concerned with Plato's public exposition of verses of the Koran writes:

"Plato You seem like an intelligent human being yet display such hatred. Please tell me, do you have a chip on your shoulder? "

If you look impartially at what Plato writes - rather than through the victim lens, you'll see that what he does is quote passages from the Koran - and point out either their lack of logic - or in those cases where it is apparent - how reprehensible they are. Or that they are a cause for barbaric behaviour by current day co-religionists of yours.

"It is clear to me with your remarks that you mean to prove a point. "

Yes, well that is why we have writing.

".....That point is clearly your hatred for Islam."

Plato's remarks are always quite clear and free of emotional content . Can you back up your statement with an example of such hatred?

" Yet, you mention that you are looking to educate the others who are not aware of Islam. Is this not the same as perhaps fear mongering?"

Now, Mr. Sufi. you must also think yourself an intelligent man. Is there something innately wrong with warning fellow human beings about potential danger? Was it wrong for German citizens in Bavaria in 1934 to warn people about German National Socialism. If you were a Brown Shirt then - of course you'd think so - as National Socialism was the idea de jour - leading all of Germany onto a glorious free and democratic future. At that time people were bashed and worse for daring to dispute it. Much the same way that Muslim thugs in the west take to intimidating and bashing - and in some cases killing - vocal opponents of the new 'theo-fascism' being imported from the middle east.

" If the Quran to you is nothing more than a book with words that you feel brews hatred and animosity, then please, stop reading it and be content that you have discovered something you clearly dislike."
Exactly what the said Brown Shirt would have said about anybody who was reading Mein Kampf at the time. Do you think that being content with just reading the book, and meekly not expressing any objections to it was the right thing to do? Or the actions of a moral coward?

Now take off your sufi cap - and if it is possible - become totally impartial - and apply the same logic to the (by any means) of Koran and the introduction of all its accompanying baggage (sharia , pro-arab anti-Jewish bias, mecca, hajj , buraks, etc etc ad nauseam) to the west.

So in answer to your heading - 'Plato, why such animosity towards a book' - if it was just the book, he'd have read it quietly and put it back on the shelf of other books he has read - under the category of extremely poor fiction. It is not the book per se - it is the attendant negative effects on the minds of millions that unfortunately live on the same planet that Plato lives on. How many other books do you know that have led people into justifying their own suicides and the murders of thousands by flying jets into buildings? What was that great thinker Mohammed Attar saying just before impact do you think - 'one small step for a muslim - one giant leap for Islam' - or 'Allahu Akbar'?

". My friend, if you wish to have a debate about theology, you must also understand the underpinnings of linguistics. Unlike the English language, the Arabic language is fairly verbose and precise. In fact, there exist many words in Arabic that have no equivalent English word. One such word is Kafir whose English translation presented in the media is Infidel. In the Quran, there is no word used that even resembles the definition of the word Infidel. "

So, in the easy to understand Koran - what does the word mean ? If it means something totally innocuous - why have so many millions of muslims misunderstood it?

"....The words in English can come close to resemble the translation in a rudimentary way, but will fail to accurately describe it."

So people who cannot speak arabic have no hope of understanding its obscurities. It's not totally clear and easy to understand and has so many contexts. Quite a trick isn't it - so many imams of different sects interpret it differently amongst themselves- so what it REALLY means depends upon the mood and disposition of the reader .

" Arabic is not the only language with these characteristics. Take French for example or even Chinese or Urdu."

Ah, too early in the morning for a red herring

" I would recommend that you consider understanding the roots of a language before you apply your statements ad nauseum. "

People with PhD's in linguistics have studied the Koran and have come to similar conclusions to Plato - that it is inconsistent, incongruous and contradicts itself and incites violence. But I do understand a little about psychology neurobiology and how looked at through the prism of the 'true believer' - it's all makes sense .

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