safraz stop

Submitted by susan (Italy), Dec 30, 2006 at 16:20

"You have a severe lack of perspective. If you were around during the height of the Ottoman Empire - when it was the world's center of science, medicine, and the arts"

all stolen from previous civilization.

Read this enlightning story by a descendant of the assyrians that clearly stated all the advanced studies in science and medicine WERE NOT DONE BY MUSLIMS

http://www.ninevehsoft.com/fiorina.htm

I was particularly interested in the story you told at the end of your speech, about the Arab/Muslim civilization. As an Assyrian, a non-Arab, Christian native of the Middle East, whose ancestors reach back to 5000 B.C., I wish to clarify some points you made in this little story, and to alert you to the dangers of unwittingly being drawn into the Arabist/Islamist ideology, which seeks to assimilate all cultures and religions into the Arab/Islamic fold.

Having conquered the Middle East, Arabs placed these communities under a Dhimmi (see the book Dhimmi, by Bat Ye'Or) system of governance, where the communities were allowed to rule themselves as religious minorities (Christians, Jews and Zoroastrian). These communities had to pay a tax (called a Jizzya in Arabic) that was, in effect, a penalty for being non-Muslim, and that was typically 80% in times of tolerance and up to 150% in times of oppression. This tax forced many of these communities to convert to Islam, as it was designed to do.

You state, "its architects designed buildings that defied gravity." I am not sure what you are referring to, but if you are referring to domes and arches, the fundamental architectural breakthrough of using a parabolic shape instead of a spherical shape for these structures was made by the Assyrians more than 1300 years earlier, as evidenced by their archaeological record.

You state, "its mathematicians created the algebra and algorithms that would enable the building of computers, and the creation of encryption." The fundamental basis of modern mathematics had been laid down not hundreds but thousands of years before by Assyrians and Babylonians, who already knew of the concept of zero, of the Pythagorean Theorem, and of many, many other developments expropriated by Arabs/Muslims (see History of Babylonian Mathematics, Neugebauer).

You state, "its doctors examined the human body, and found new cures for disease." The overwhelming majority of these doctors (99%) were Assyrians. In the fourth, fifth, and sixth centuries Assyrians began a systematic translation of the Greek body of knowledge into Assyrian. At first they concentrated on the religious works but then quickly moved to science, philosophy and medicine. Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Galen, and many others were translated into Assyrian, and from Assyrian into Arabic. It is these Arabic translations which the Moors brought with them into Spain, and which the Spaniards translated into Latin and spread throughout Europe, thus igniting the European Renaissance.

By the sixth century A.D., Assyrians had begun exporting back to Byzantia their own works on science, philosophy and medicine. In the field of medicine, the Bakhteesho Assyrian family produced nine generations of physicians, and founded the great medical school at Gundeshapur (Iran). Also in the area of medicine, (the Assyrian) Hunayn ibn-Ishaq's textbook on ophthalmology, written in 950 A.D., remained the authoritative source on the subject until 1800 A.D.

In the area of philosophy, the Assyrian philosopher Job of Edessa developed a physical theory of the universe, in the Assyrian language, that rivaled Aristotle's theory, and that sought to replace matter with forces (a theory that anticipated some ideas in quantum mechanics, such as the spontaneous creation and destruction of matter that occurs in the quantum vacuum).

One of the greatest Assyrian achievements of the fourth century was the founding of the first university in the world, the School of Nisibis, which had three departments, theology, philosophy and medicine, and which became a magnet and center of intellectual development in the Middle East. The statutes of the School of Nisibis, which have been preserved, later became the model upon which the first Italian university was based (see The Statutes of the School of Nisibis, by Arthur Voobus).

When Arabs and Islam swept through the Middle East in 630 A.D., they encountered 600 years of Assyrian Christian civilization, with a rich heritage, a highly developed culture, and advanced learning institutions. It is this civilization that became the foundation of the Arab civilization.

Islam the religion itself was significantly molded by Assyrians and Jews (see Nestorian Influence on Islam and Hagarism: the Making of the Islamic World).

Arabs/Muslims are engaged in an explicit campaign of destruction and expropriation of cultures and communities, identities and ideas. Wherever Arab/Muslim civilization encounters a non-Arab/Muslim one, it attempts to destroy it (as the Buddhist statues in Afghanistan were destroyed, as Persepolis was destroyed by the Ayotollah Khomeini). This is a pattern that has been recurring since the advent of Islam, 1400 years ago, and is amply substantiated by the historical record. If the "foreign" culture cannot be destroyed, then it is expropriated, and revisionist historians claim that it is and was Arab, as is the case of most of the Arab "accomplishments" you cited in your speech.

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as you can see safraz, your "muslim civilization" can only stand on its legs when it's about stealing from others and later claim as your own-

http://www.srpska-mreza.com/History/pre-wwOne/Ye_Or.html

the above is other lies on the Myths and Politics: Origin of the Myth of a Tolerant Pluralistic Islamic Society (referred to former yugoslavia land, the ottoman empire you brag about so much)

Muslim tolerance and muslim pluralism are oxymoron

Let us now confront the myth with reality. A systematic enquiry into the condition of the Christians was conducted by British consuls in the Ottoman Empire in the 1860s. Britain was then Turkey's strongest ally. It was in its own interest to see that the oppression of the Christians would be eliminated in order to prevent any Russian or Austrian interference. Consul James Zohrab sent from Bosna-Serai (Sarajevo) a lengthy report, dated July 22, 1860, to his ambassador in Constantinople, Sir Henry Bulwer, in which he analyzed the administration of the provinces of Bosnia and Herzegovina. He stated that from 1463 to 1850 the Bosniak Muslims enjoyed all the privileges of feudalism. During a period of nearly 300 years Christians were subjected to much oppression and cruelty. For them no other law but the caprice of their masters existed.

The Devshirme system is well known. Begun by the Sultan Orkhan (1326-1359), it existed for about 300 years. It consisted of a regular levy of Christian children from the Christian population of the Balkans. These youngsters, aged from fourteen to twenty, were Islamized and enslaved for their army. The periodic levies, which took place in contingents of a thousand, subsequently became annual. To discourage runaways, children were transferred to remote provinces and entrusted to Muslim soldiers who treated them harshly as slaves. Another parallel recruitment system operated. It provided for the levy of Christian children aged six to ten (Ichoghlani), reserved for the sultans' palace. Entrusted to eunuchs, they underwent a tyrannical training for fourteen years. (A system of enslaving Black Christian and Animist children, similar to the Devshirme, existed in Sudan as is shown from documents to be published in my book. A sort of Devshirme system still exists today in Sudan and has been described and denounced by the United Nations Special Report on Sudan and in a recent article last Friday's Times of London.)

WHAT DO YOU SAY SAFRAZ ABOUT THE TOLERANCE IN OTTOMAN EMPIRE?

STILL IN 1875 THE TESTIMONY OF CHRISTIANS AND JEWS WAS WORTH NOTHING IN A TRIAL, HOW'S THAT SAFRAZ?

"you would probably be arguing that Islam was superior because its fruits were better than Christianity's. "

NO SAFRAZ, NO RACIST, SUPREMACIST IDEOLOGY IS SUPERIOR!

How's that safraz, in ottoman empire 1875 still christians and jews were worth nothing in a trial in bosnia!!!

How come 1875 is not long time ago, it's not 7th century arabia!

"Furthermore, you somehow dissassociate Jim Jones and Jonestown from Christianity. Jones was a Christian - does that make Christianity a religion of violence? Or does that make Jim Jones a radical Christian who is to be condemned, much like bin Laden and his cohorts are radical Muslims to be condemend?"

no, that jim jones, (that hardly nobody knows) was acting against the christianity teachings, Binh Laden is acting according to your 7th century book.

BY THE WAY SAFRAZ; learn how your holy book is a fraud

http://www.sullivan-county.com/x/koran_prob.htm

"And let me ask you - when last has Muslim tried to convert you? A good Muslim never tries to convert anyone by force."

I live in a western country where muslims are still the minority, however, indonesia, thailand, malaysia and the rest of the muslim majority country are full of stories of muslims kidnapping usually girls to convert them

http://www.crossrhythms.co.uk/articles/life/Christian_Girls_Kidnapped_In_Egypt_And_Forced_To_Convert_To_Islam/22375/p1/

Christian Girls Kidnapped In Egypt And Forced To Convert To Islam

what do you say now safraz?

please tell us ...how that is not real islam.

Egypt is an islamic country.

Also safraz, take notice of how muslim converting to christianity face harassment, discrimination in "modern" morocco.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20061213/lf_afp/moroccoreligion_061213150215

RABAT (AFP) - They might have Islamic names like Mohammed or Ali, but every Sunday these Moroccan converts to Christianity go discreetly to "church" -- to the ire of Islamic militants and under the suspicious eye of police.

Please safraz, tell us how come your supremacist, superior religion is so much scared of converts? maybe because you muslims know you are a fraud? maybe because you know any other religion is a threat to islam because islam is a fraud?

Islam is so weak, muslims are the weakest people on the planet. Always stealing from others, always bragging about what they are NOT!

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