Very interesting and many thanks to Rasheed

Submitted by dhimmi no more (United States), Dec 24, 2010 at 08:26

Dr. Pipes: you and Robert Spencer were just great. The difficulty with the likes of Moustafa Zayed, and I really felt sorry for him, is that he is the product of poor Egyptian education and he does not have the tools of critical thinking to examine any issue and provide an answer that can make sense and his basic fatal flaws are the following

1. He is not a historian and his command of islamic theology is either poor or he is making thins up and the little he knows is what the Arabs would call fahlawa or style but no substance

2. He tells us that if the Qur'an and the hadith say so then it must be so and case in point is ayat la ikrah fi al-deen or the no compulsion in religion verse and he does not tell us about the sword verse and in his mind he believes that we will not question him and we will be all saying; Amen! but it is very clear in the Islamic tradition that this verse was abrogated by the infamous ayat al-sayf or the sword verse which is really about: polytheists must either convert to Islam or be killed. As for quoting some hadith about the fact that Muhammad was quoted as saying to treat the Jews and Christians well then this is against what the Qur'an says and against Ibn Taymiyya's rantings about the fact that the Jews and Christians are really polythiests and against what really happened in real history and more damaging to his case is that such hadith is regarded by his tradition as hadith da3eef or not very reliable hadith. And this hadith would be regarded by historians of early islam as an anachronistic hadith that has no value and means nothing

And I'm very glad that Robert Spencer pointed out to him that Ibn Maymun or Maimonides had no regard for Islam but in the mind of Moustafa; If Ibn Maymun wrote in Arabic then he and the Jews must have been well treated by Muslims! Where is the logic here? Well if so then Zakaria Botros and the Copts must have been well treated by Muslims and islam

There is no doubt that the theology in the Qur'an and the hadith is very confusing and you will find, as Patricia Crone had stated: the A but not the A and only Allahu a3lam (only Allah knows) to just about any thing and you might even find some where that Muhammad might have been a British monarchist as was pointed out by some Mullah in London that I do not recall his name

2. He is not a historian and indeed islam is no more than Arabian imperialism and as was pointed out by Crone that the Arabs loved to invade and collect booty, their God told them to do so and these are indeed the reasons for the Arab invasions of the late antique Middle East

3. He does not realize that another basic flaw in islam is that its theology is based on polemics (see Wansbrough's Sectarian Milieu) and this would mean that any form of dialog between Muslims and non Muslims can never work

4. As for the jizya he was trying to justify the absurd and even if we agree with his absurd claim that the jizya is supposed ot be $100 well this is lots of money for many people back then and even now! And to "protect" non Muslims from what? And he also forgot to tell us that the jizya must be paid and the non Muslim must be humiliated. How disgusting

5. And notice also that he did not have any answer to Dr. Pipes points that the in-equality of Muslims and non Muslims and of men and woman cannot be accepted any more

6. Notice that Moustafa was silent about the Hindus and the Buddhists and the atheists

7. As for Rasheed I did some research and he is a star in the Middle East and he has a progarm on Qanat al-haya or life channel and he is watched by millions in the Middle East every Thrusday and it is called Su'al jari' or daring question and he is indeed a convert from Islam to Christianity and he is from Morroco. Notice that Moustafa did not have any replies to Rasheed's well explained points.

8. As for Kunte: He is ignorant and annoying

Dr. Pipes; I would love to see such an exchange between you and Robert Spencer and Tariq Ramadan and the so called shiekh Abdul Rauf

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