Turkey, one of the most secular states in the world????

Submitted by the Grand Infidel of Kaffiristan (Australia), Jan 11, 2011 at 05:46

Mr Havas, unable to counter ANY (i.e. not even one) points at all from my last post and obviously feeling persecuted, lashes out at the phantoms of his own imagination by writing:

"turkey is one of the most secular state of the world since 80 years.so much that still women cant use head cover in official places. you teach me secularity.how ignorant."

In other words - it is so 'secular' that it has to make a point about appearing secular? There's something very suspect about that. It's so secular that there are still more than 80,000 mosques and 1500 being built each year - and has more imams than doctors.

"Australia ,america and european countries invited millions of foreigners to their countries. because they needed population and workers . and those muslims for 50 years were good people . "

Your sentence implies that Australia, america and European countries invited ONLY muslims . That is entirely incorrect. many more millions were from other parts of Europe and eventually south east Asia. I cannot speak for other countries - but Australia only allowed in any significant number of muslims in the mid 70's - as refugees from bloody civil war in Lebanon. Take that point - as refugees - people who needed our help. They certainly were not sought out for their work ethic or their ability to easily integrate into western culture. The result now is - whole suburbs that have become muslim enclaves with attendant social problems and poor dress sense. Another result is our police have a dedicated 'Middle eastern crime' squad..

"....and suddenly they became terrorists."

Not at all. The drug trade's domination by middle eastern gangs were prevalent before 9/11. Certainly the exposure that 9/11 brought to muslim communities has shown up what had been festering unnoticed for years.

"these people are your people now,mostly they were born there,"

Not in Australia's case. Most muslim adults have been born overseas. Many have sought Australian passports - and having obtained them - go back to their countries of origin - using the passport as a lifeline in the event of the inevitable flareups hat have and certainly will continue to arise in that region.

".....and we are not interested about your internal social problems. "

Nor should you be. Not that you could offer any assistance anyway that we could not offer ourselves.

".....even if you pay me twice sallary , ı wont come to your country. dont worry.'

Promise???? Or is this just taqiyya?

"What happened to aborgines."

You mean the 1 to 2 million individuals of 500 or so often warring nations who spoke more than 200 languages and did not even invent the wheel on the world's flattest continent after 40,000 years residence? What happened to them when they were confronted with another civilisation that superior technology? I expect all those folks would they would have all died by now. If you know any different - please let me know where I can find them.

"....do you have any left? "

Do you mean full blood descendants - or mixed race? I suggest you do your own research and get back to us on that one. It will be good practice for you and quite possibly a novel experience - to seek the truth .

"...may be few in the zoos"

That may be the practice in Turkey - but we don't keep people in zoos.

."...and you talk about armenian so called tragedy."

What have I said about the Armenian tragedy?? Anything at all??? And why do you persist in calling it 'so-called'? Do you see it as a friendly picnic?

"how funny how hypocratic."

You really should learn to spell a little better. Hippocratic oath is the oath muslim doctors break when they administer state-sanctioned maiming of individuals from breaking sharia law in many muslim countries - such as blinding and limb amputation. And certainly when they attack airport terminals or shoot fellow workers in the back.

"....and why you people come to dardanelle to invade my country 100 years ago. "

Australia was invited there by the British - who were joined with the French in seeking a supply route to Russia. This was against the backdrop of the German and Austro-Hungarian choking of supply routes to Russia. No one, even then, was particularly interested in turkey per se.

".....but you experienced that we muslims are no aborgines hah?"

Oh , I see, you're getting personal and nationalistic now? An attempt at baiting me to identify as an 'Australian' and get angry at the slaughter on the beaches of Gallipoli - where the Turks fought under the direction of German General von Sanders? Again - do your own research and get your facts straight before shooting yourself in the foot. This was the battle where Turks were shooting down from sandhills at Australia, french and UK troops right? The same series of battles where there was massive loss of Turkish lives - and many deaths from 'friendly fire' by Turks themselves? OK - it's well documented. There were about 8,000 Australians killed in those days. Turkish casualties are estimated at 250000 (65000 killed)

".....it is a great shame to insult anybodies culture ,even if you dont like that culture,"

Why is your ego so huge - that you perceive the pointing out of glaringly obvious facts as insults?

"......which you people constantly do and boast about how massive you can do this."

How 'massive' we can do what? If you mean - how EASILY we can point out how backward and barbaric many aspects of islamic culture is? Well, I'd have to agree with you. It's not a matter of boasting though you might see it like that. It's more the point of getting your fellow 'believers' to see the obvious.

"....this shows the ugliness of your culture has no humanity in it ."

Which culture aqree you taking about - European culture - the same European culture a few blogs ago you were so admiring? .The culture which gives more aid around the world than any muslim culture does, has banned the death penalty for generations, excels in medicine and science, jurisprudence, architecture and every other field of endeavour? That does NOT practice limb amputation for crimes of theft? Does not stone people to death for totally spurious reasons?. That allows total freedom of belief and religion? The same culture that promotes.

"....this is why future is not yours.future is ours....."

Who is 'ours' - Turks or muslims. I see the grey wolf comes out - perhaps you aree not as enlihtened as you believe yourself to be. Your sufi beliefs obviously have a very large undercurrent of traditional islamic belief. You think islam will conquer the world don't you. How do you know that Allah the makr hasn't been playing a little game of deception with his precious muslims? A 'lila' as the Hindus might suggest. Could be couldn't it - as alah is thr best deceiver - even your scripture says so.

Perhaps you're being used as an example of how far humanity can delude itself when it comes to the uselessness of rites and rituals and religious extremism in the pursuit of the realisation of truth. scary thought isn't it? You can feel your own mind closing to that idea right now if you step back from yourself and look.

No - there's no chance of the future belonging to entirely to muslims. Some people who are alive now who have that belief about themselves may be alive in 20 years time. But by then certainly their viewpoints and belief system will have radically changed. So much so that they will humbly admit they do not know what they are talking about - and have just repeated mindlessly what has been handed down to them through generations.

Here's a paragraph from a wise American man who lived late last century by the name of Vernon Howard.

"Unreal human beings take their life as being real. Human beings
who live without knowledge of their inner world always believe
that they understand their inner world. Living from this mass
of delusion and confusion, they have no reason in their own minds
for discovering what life is all about, what they are really all
about. A human being always operates and acts from what he
believes about himself and regardless of how ridiculous it is,
he takes it as being proper, as being good, as being necessary,
as being wise, simply because the condition is his. And there
you come into the incredible depths of vanity. Just because
something occurs within a man, or a woman, he or she calls it
good simply because it belongs to them.

'Of course, I'm good!' What an atrocity to commit against yourself
to think just because something belongs to you that it has to be
noble and right and intelligent. That's a part of the madness of
humanity."

Think about it.

It applies to every human being - except you, Havas, of course.

"....in america there is terror all the time. should we call them christian terrorists?"

Are you talking about urban crime rates? i.e. non-religiously based crimes ? Facts and figures are available . Would you like to compare the USA and similar nations with Turkey for example? I'm afraid you have me at a disadvantage here - for a lot of crime goes unreported in Turkey and so the figures will be skewed. But even so - Turkey is right up there for many serious offences. So what was your point?

Any video you can point me to showing Christian people beheading non-Christians for religious reasons? And shouting 'God is great' while doing so?? Any Buddhists murdering musims for the same reasons ? Any Christians or Sikhs laughing and clapping as the life drains out of people hung for being gay? Any Christians or Buddhists or jains keeping modern day slaves? Or throwing stones at people buried up to their waists for sleeping around? Any Buddhists or Hindus or Jews dong the same? So, to answer your question - no, I don't think muslims should call them or people of any other belief 'terrorists' - until muslims improve their behaviour and stop their barbaric practices.

"...europes rejection of turkey is very important. we want to hear this from them. they must announce" we dont want you because you are muslims."

It's not because they are muslims specifically - it is because of the attendant social problems that would be introduced to Europe. And also Turkey's poor border control would be like allowing an open door for thousands of psychopaths from less 'secular'muslim societies , intent on listening to the voices in their heads thyat are constantly telling them exactly what Allah wants to do to all the filthy kuffar who strangely, have not surrendered to islam - even after hearing of its wonders after all this time! Such stubborn people, these kuffar, aren't they? They're just begging to be smitten by allah's mesengers.

" white western christian imperialiam is creating hatered ,division among people,racizm is your typical character,"

Are you trying to be insulting - or does it just flow out of your mouth like honey so easily ?

You are the only one bringing race into this equation. There are white Christians, black Christians white Jews and even black Jews, Indian Christians, Indian Hindus, Arab Christians, Chinese Christians, Chinese Buddhists , Russian Christians and Russian Jews living in the west (and of course in Russia ) . And as you know - even Muslims.

"....destroying the planet is your main mission."

Who sells by far and away most of the oil on the planet? Hint : the home of the tektite idol.

And guess which country has and wants more pipelines through its territory? And would your own country be one has not invented any of the polluting technologies but certainly uses them ? And of those countries which invented polluting technologies (i.e. coal fired power stations and the internal combustion engine are the largest culprits ) - which are putting enormous funding and research into alternatives? Hint: all have been major players in WW2. And no, despite what your history books tell you - Turkey is not one of them

"... how funny, you target the muslims to cover all your dirtiness."

'hypocrisy' is spelled 'h y p o c r i s y'.

"...but ı agree with you if you dont want muslims then they must unite".

How can you agree with what was not said?

"...why should we try to be together with people who hates us, "

The persecution complex again. sorry - it falls on deaf ears.

"....certainly we must work together with people who likes us."

People who'll tell you only what you want to hear - must be your best friends, right?

"....and ı give a break again. see you next year."

Really promise? Let's see if you can keep your word this time.

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