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Fighting in Allah's cause

Reader comment on item: The Pentagon Looks at the Koran
in response to reader comment: Answer the question

Submitted by Henrik Ræder Clausen (Denmark), Oct 10, 2006 at 17:46

"The article is about Koran, not Hadiths, so leave Hadiths out of this, please."

Why? Because the Hadith would prove me right without breaking a sweat? OK, just for the fun of the game, I'll restrict myself a bit. But do remember that the Hadith is also 'holy' scripture and shows the example that Muhammad set for Muslims. They're relevant and should be studied.

You did not tell us what you found wrong with fighting in the way of God. I don't see anything wrong. Do you?

I most certainly do.

And what is wrong in fighting in the cause of Allah? What does Al Quran say about fighting in the cause of Allah?

Chapter 4/75: And why should you not fight in the way of God, while the defenseless among the men, women and children say "Our Lord, deliver us from this town. Its people are oppressive. And make for us from your presence a guardian, and make for us from your presence a helper."

This is but an excuse. If you go through the life story of Muhammad, you'll find that this supposed 'oppression' was merely that they rejected Muhammad's claim to be a prophet, presumably because he could not keep the legends straight, and because he switched between monotheistic and polytheistic in his last year in Mecca (the Satanic Verses incident). Worshipping Al-Rahman, Allah, Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, or Manat. Still, it was only verbal rejection. The worst anyone ever did against him before he himself took to arms was to drag him around a bit (that's in Ibn Ishaq page 131). That is NOT justification for taking up plunder and killing.

Chapter 2/190: And fight in the way of God against those who fight you, and do not aggress. Surely God does not love the aggressors.

Is it wrong to fight to defend the oppressed men, women and children? Is wrong to fight those who fight you. Find anything wrong in these verses? I think not.

OK, several things here.
First, my translation reads 'transgressor', not 'aggressor'. That does not help you much, though. If Allah really hates the aggressor, Muhammad must be spending his sorry afterlife in the deepest levels of Hell. The Hadith, which you tried to count out, is still the only reasonably reliable source to his life, and he personally commanded or guided more than 70 raids and battles that were clearly aggressive. Only the battle at Uhud and the Battle of the Trench were defensive battles, and both were reactions to the extensive plunder committed by Muhammad and the early Muslims, attempting to put and end to his disturbance of the peace and the normal trade. Still, I'm using only Islamic sources for this, and I have the books right here with me.

Then you conveniently left out the footnote in the Quran I have quoted for you already. I'll repeat it, and hope you'll get it this time. It reads:

Noble Qur'an 2:190 Footnote: "Jihad is holy fighting in Allah's Cause with full force of numbers and weaponry. It is given the utmost importance in Islam and is one of its pillars. By Jihad Islam is established, Allah's Word is made superior (which means only Allah has the right to be worshiped), and Islam is propagated. By abandoning Jihad Islam is destroyed and Muslims fall into an inferior position; their honor is lost, their lands are stolen, their rule and authority vanish. Jihad is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim. He who tries to escape from this duty, or does not fulfill this duty, dies as a hypocrite."

Third, lets get things into context - the next verse reads:
2:191: And kill them whereever you find them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out. And al-Fithnat (disbelief) is worse than killing. And fight not with them at Al-Masjid Al-Haram (at Mecca), unless they (first) fight you there. But if they attack you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the unbelievers.

Worth noting is that Muhammad personally broke the instruction of 2:191 to not fight people at Mecca unless they had attacked first. His conquest of Mecca was unprovoked.

It is a very noble cause, I think. So I don't see any problem with the Koranic verses that you quoted.

If you still believe it to be noble after the above, I'll give you a score more Quran quotes:

Qur'an 2:193 "Fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief) and religion is only for Allah. But if they cease/desist, let there be no hostility except against infidel disbelievers."

My take is that this is in response to what happened after the Satanic Verses, where the Meccans were really unhappy with him. Unfortunately, the entire year from he entered the Satanic Verses deal until his escape to Medina has been erased from written history. Looks like the Quresh eventually threw Muhammad out of the Ka'aba, and he decided that to be sufficient justification to take up weapons against them:

Qur'an 2:217 "They question you concerning fighting in the sacred month. Say: ‘Fighting therein is a grave (matter); but to prevent access to Allah, to deny Him, to prevent access to the Sacred Mosque, to expel its members, and polytheism are worse than slaughter. Nor will they cease fighting you until they make you renegades from your religion. If any of you turn back and die in unbelief, your works will be lost and you will go to Hell. Surely those who believe and leave their homes to fight in Allah's Cause have the hope of Allah's mercy."

Qur'an 2:244 "Fight in Allah's Cause, and know that Allah hears and knows all."

Qur'an 2:246 "He said: ‘Would you refrain from fighting if fighting were prescribed for you?' They said: ‘How could we refuse to fight in Allah's Cause?'"

Fatalism:
Qur'an 3:154 "Say: ‘Even if you had remained in your houses, those ordained to be slaughtered would have gone forth to the places where they were to slain."

Qur'an 4:74 "Let those who fight in Allah's Cause sell this world's life for the hereafter. To him who fights in Allah's Cause, whether he is slain or victorious, We shall give him a reward."
Qur'an 4:75 "What reason have you that you should not fight in Allah's Cause?" "What is wrong with you that you do not fight for Allah?"
Qur'an 4:76 "Those who believe fight in the Cause of Allah."
Qur'an 4:77 "Have you not seen those to whom it was said: Withhold from fighting, perform the prayer and pay the zakat. But when orders for fighting were issued, a party of them feared men as they ought to have feared Allah. They say: ‘Our Lord, why have You ordained fighting for us, why have You made war compulsory?'"
Qur'an 4:78 "Wherever you are, death will find you, even if you are in towers strong and high! So what is wrong with these people, that they fail to understand these simple words?"

Qur'an 8:5 "Your Lord ordered you out of your homes to fight for the true cause, even though some Muslims disliked it, and were averse (to fighting)."

This one is important for suicide bombers today. Special attention here:


Qur'an 8:65 "O Prophet, urge the faithful to fight. If there are twenty among you with determination they will vanquish two hundred; if there are a hundred then they will slaughter a thousand unbelievers, for the infidels are a people devoid of understanding."

No protection for those who do not fight:
Qur'an 8:72 "Those who accepted Islam and left their homes to fight in Allah's Cause with their possessions and persons, and those who gave (them) asylum, aid, and shelter, those who harbored them—these are allies of one another. You are not responsible for protecting those who embraced Islam but did not leave their homes to fight until they do so."

Qur'an 9:5 "Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war."

Qur'an 9:14 "Fight them and Allah will punish them by your hands, lay them low, and cover them with shame. He will help you over them."

Qur'an 9:29 "Fight those who do not believe until they all surrender, paying the protective tax in submission."

Qur'an 9:38 "Believers, what is the matter with you, that when you are asked to go forth and fight in Allah's Cause you cling to the earth? Do you prefer the life of this world to the Hereafter? Unless you go forth, He will afflict and punish you with a painful doom and put others in your place."

Qur'an 9:88 "The Messenger and those who believe with him, strive hard and fight with their wealth and lives in Allah's Cause."

Qur'an 9:111 "The Believers fight in Allah's Cause, they slay and are slain, kill and are killed."

Qur'an 61:2 "O Muslims, why say one thing and do another? Grievously odious and hateful is it in the sight of Allah that you say that which you do not. Truly Allah loves those who fight in His Cause in a battle array, as if they were a solid cemented structure."

That should do for now. There are many more quotes to show, and then the Hadith that shows the context these quotes were given in.

If you still believe this is a 'very noble cause', I'll count you among the 'Blood and honour' worshippers :)

I recommend that you read the life story of Muhammad, for instance by Ibn Ishaq. He lists all the battles, describes the circumstances, tells about killing and enslaving the local Jews - and doesn't even try to pretend that the Jews had attacked Muhammad or the Muslims. They obviously had no weapons at all!

'Very noble cause'? Now, please explain yourself...

Submitting....

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Reader comments (113) on this item

Title Commenter Date Thread
1Making Pentagon's task easier [175 words]B.N.GururajFeb 28, 2009 09:52151341
1lawful Islam -the real danger [147 words]RadovanJun 17, 2007 22:3698933
1true islam. [80 words]muslimMar 11, 2009 17:2298933
1True Islam?? [140 words]KevinOct 1, 2009 17:0298933
1Bogus war on terror [202 words]johnDec 26, 2006 09:1870587
1Pentagon is waking up to the reality, but... [1129 words]MohanNov 1, 2006 11:5464998
Can Islam be reformed? [88 words]Jon PurizhanskyNov 8, 2006 19:2564998
Bravo Mohan!!!! [308 words]BettyNov 26, 2006 18:3964998
1War on Islam has to be of Ideas [254 words]B.N.GururajMar 2, 2009 22:3764998
1Islam the motivation of terrorism (The quran, the hadith, and the sunnah) [69 words]Kelvan KamOct 24, 2006 18:5264393
a pointless debate [67 words]yahecurbOct 24, 2006 10:2264332
It makes all of the difference [158 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 28, 2006 03:5164332
Only 5 Years? [32 words]Edwin F. BuckleyOct 16, 2006 16:5560586
WRONG END OF THE HORSE [143 words]DONVANOct 13, 2006 15:4060253
Yeah with many Ulema giving you different intepretation islam will never "wind up" with the facts [96 words]Kelvan KamOct 14, 2006 03:3060253
excellent point... [96 words]donvanOct 16, 2006 09:1860253
They may actually get it one of these days [174 words]Peter HerzOct 12, 2006 17:1560047
1Satanic verses are Ibn Ishaq page 161 ff [332 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 12, 2006 18:4760047
Will the Pentagon also take on the United States Supreme Court? [211 words]AkbarOct 10, 2006 15:3559630
Is not unconstitutional to remove the image of Muhammad. [125 words]Kelvan KamOct 11, 2006 00:1559630
Good point Akbar,almost [99 words]donvanOct 18, 2006 17:2759630
Crusades should be relaunched [34 words]jack hawkinsOct 8, 2006 11:2959299
The Crusades continue! [269 words]AkbarOct 6, 2006 11:0959129
Koran [268 words]RamaOct 8, 2006 07:5359129
Resuming the Crusades? [109 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 9, 2006 15:4759129
No to Turkey in the European Union [45 words]Octavio JohansonOct 9, 2006 17:0859129
Resuming the Crusades [90 words]akbarOct 9, 2006 19:0059129
European Union vs. Turkey [45 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 9, 2006 21:1859129
1If the Crusades WERE Continuing.... [155 words]El CidOct 13, 2006 17:4459129
Reply to Akbar on the Bible [422 words]Peter J. HerzOct 14, 2006 16:0559129
You don't have to worry, there will be no EU left soon [83 words]OctavianNov 3, 2006 00:0059129
have a clean europe...have a turkey out of europe! [44 words]mikeDec 24, 2006 18:3259129
1Yeah, Mike! [87 words]OctavioDec 25, 2006 17:1959129
1No Turkey [25 words]OctavioDec 25, 2006 17:2259129
For how long did the Pentagon stare at the Koran? [504 words]FahadOct 6, 2006 07:5859107
Definition of Jihad [389 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 10, 2006 03:0559107
Henrik, get a better translation, please [473 words]FahadOct 11, 2006 08:0459107
My translation is as official as it gets! [139 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 11, 2006 17:1159107
1Correction [308 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 11, 2006 17:2659107
Did the Pentagon really look at the Quran at all? [237 words]FahadOct 11, 2006 18:5859107
1For Fahad and his lesson in the Arabic langauge and quranic ta'weel! [252 words]dhimmi no moreOct 11, 2006 19:4759107
Quran does not belong to the Saudis [406 words]FahadOct 12, 2006 07:2759107
1For Fahad and suicide in the Qur'an and the sira and the hadith and other sordid matters! [351 words]dhimmi no moreOct 12, 2006 13:1559107
1For Fahad and suicide in the Qur'an and the sira and the hadith and other sordid matters part deux! [37 words]dhimmi no moreOct 12, 2006 18:3159107
References from the Quran? [321 words]FahadOct 12, 2006 20:5159107
1For Fahad: and Arabian imperialism! [220 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 06:5659107
1For Henrik: You are doing a good job! [138 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 07:1259107
For Fahad: bogus claims and translation of Quran 4:95 part deux! [299 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 15:0059107
1For fahad: and Saudi transaltions of the Qur'an [158 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 15:1659107
1For Fahad: and his bogus claims! [74 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 17:0959107
For Fahad: and his bogus claims part deux! [36 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 17:2259107
1For fahad: your claims are bogus! [28 words]dhimmi no moreOct 13, 2006 17:3759107
For the madrassa students [151 words]FahadOct 13, 2006 19:3459107
1Thanks, pal! [60 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 14, 2006 06:5659107
1For Fahad: and his bogus claims and assertions! [682 words]dhimmi no moreOct 14, 2006 08:5359107
1To dhimmi no more [185 words]VijayOct 14, 2006 09:4959107
1For Fahad: bogus claims and "fight in the cause of Allah" part deux [745 words]dhimmi no moreOct 14, 2006 16:1559107
For "dhimmi no more" , the madrassa man. [568 words]FahadOct 14, 2006 21:3359107
1For Fahad and the words: Muqatil and Mujahid and bogus claims [74 words]dhimmi no moreOct 15, 2006 07:4159107
1For Vijay: Thank you [176 words]dhimmi no moreOct 15, 2006 08:0359107
1For Fahad: and the fantasy continues part deux! [157 words]dhimmi no moreOct 15, 2006 08:2659107
2For Fahd/Fahad: Qur'an 2:216 revisited and the fantasy continues part trois! [482 words]dhimmi no moreOct 15, 2006 15:3659107
1For Fahad: and more fantasy part cinq! [208 words]dhimmi no moreOct 15, 2006 16:3659107
1Jihad means WAR! [77 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 16, 2006 03:2859107
Meaning of any word [241 words]VijayOct 20, 2006 09:4559107
meaning of Jihad [180 words]aliJul 17, 2007 09:4559107
What Islamic scripture says about Jihad [527 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenJul 21, 2007 16:1159107
Some questions for Fahad [298 words]Monte GardnerDec 1, 2007 22:0659107
Jihaad is OK if its in "self defence" [354 words]Monte GardnerDec 1, 2007 22:1759107
1Pentagon Looks at the Qur'an [131 words]InfidelOct 5, 2006 13:4759025
I agree [338 words]Stanley LivingstoneOct 5, 2006 10:3759017
suicide [35 words]Cliff MattisOct 4, 2006 23:0158975
Death in battle is not suicide [551 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 6, 2006 05:0058975
Finally! Finally [16 words]Vinod KumarOct 4, 2006 19:1258955
Now What [87 words]James BigaOct 4, 2006 11:4158905
For how long did the Pentagon stare at the Koran?! [511 words]FahadOct 4, 2006 06:4758870
1Spending your property and life in Allah's Cause [1026 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 9, 2006 02:3158870
Answer the question [196 words]FahadOct 9, 2006 18:5358870
3Fighting in Allah's cause [1633 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 10, 2006 17:4658870
the real truth [602 words]nadraOct 7, 2010 01:2158870
at last you find it!!! [190 words]psOct 4, 2006 03:3458859
voa [31 words]cyrusOct 3, 2006 15:5158770
here is the thing [121 words]BobOct 3, 2006 11:5158739
I completely agree with you (EOM) [5 words]sarah simsOct 5, 2006 08:3958739
1FINALLY [205 words]dfwhiteOct 2, 2006 19:1358639
What next? [57 words]VijayOct 2, 2006 15:4958618
2Great. Now read Hadith as well to nail the coffin. [108 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 2, 2006 15:2058615
Henrik Ræder Clausen, Qur'an not jumbled or is it [212 words]InfidelOct 3, 2006 18:0058615
Is the Koran jumbled? [94 words]VinodguptOct 4, 2006 19:0958615
Is the Koran Jumbled [12 words]RamaOct 8, 2006 09:1958615
With the problem enshrined in the Quran.... [83 words]
w/response from Daniel Pipes
MontyOct 2, 2006 15:0858612
If the government can get it right, can the Leftist media be far behind? [1005 words]Dr RJPOct 2, 2006 14:5758611
1What good parts? [64 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 3, 2006 11:1158611
1Answer to Henrik: "Whatever they take out of context from the Koran that sounds good...." [242 words]Dr RJPOct 3, 2006 16:2158611
1Attention dr. RJP [70 words]Ephraim BielefeldtOct 4, 2006 09:0958611
1The Koran [347 words]Vinod KumarOct 4, 2006 12:2858611
1Muhammad purchased his access to Jewish scriptures [163 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 5, 2006 03:2658611
1Jumbled Koran [220 words]RamaOct 6, 2006 12:2458611
1Distorsions in Koran [191 words]Act NowOct 7, 2006 11:5358611
Islam is the best path to follow. [92 words]akbarOct 7, 2006 16:4558611
Muhammad purchasing material for revelations [255 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 7, 2006 21:0058611
1Jumbled Koran [204 words]RamaOct 8, 2006 00:4958611
1Jumbled Koran [307 words]RamaOct 8, 2006 07:4458611
1Jumbled Koran [340 words]RamaOct 8, 2006 09:1658611
Rama you are mistaken [123 words]spOct 9, 2006 04:5758611
Purchasing revelations -- Clausen [88 words]Act NowOct 9, 2006 13:1958611
1...Prophet Mohammed [51 words]MofidiOct 10, 2006 03:5458611
Mislead you SP [73 words]SP you have misread the titleOct 10, 2006 09:2358611
Islam under the Prophet Muhammad [146 words]AkbarOct 10, 2006 15:5458611
1Arab history [979 words]Henrik Ræder ClausenOct 10, 2006 18:3258611
Read my comments [11 words]akbarOct 10, 2006 22:0858611
1For Akbar: and you must learn the sordid history of early islam! [140 words]dhimmi no moreOct 28, 2006 14:1058611
1Have u ever known Muhammad(swt) [257 words]advisorJun 18, 2009 13:5858611

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