Taj: Is Allah being just presumptuous in 9:111?

Submitted by Plato (India), May 2, 2008 at 00:17

Taj, you wrote:

>> Additionally, the perspective that Islam is anti-democratic is a bit presumptuous ...<<

Given 9:111 what is even more presumptuous is that Islam is in any sense pro-democratic.

>>There is no inherent relationship, supportive or contentious between Islam or any government system.<<

Islam requires a theocratic regime for its survival which is why it is supportive of governments that claim to rule by Islamic sharia. That is the supportive relationship.As to the contentious ones secular governments tend not to give special privilesges based on religion. But Muslim minorities demand to have\their own personal laws even if they clash with democratic and secular values and are inherently unjust to women. In India Muslims have their own personal laws and opposed a supreme court ruling giving alimony to a destitute old woman.

>>I would submit that the changes sought (such as civil freedoms, etc) are not new or foreign to Islam, political or otherwise - an actual historical examination of Islam, expecially at its inception reveals the first major instance of women's rights, support of the poor, the first instance of a "constitution", and even elections...<<

Islam gave rights to women, but on the plea that the Koran is Allah's final word froze them forever to be subservient to men and to be a degree lower than them.

Islam gave support to the poor with zakat and also from booty acquired through war.

Islam has a constitution, which is frozen in time (and also place, with Arab customs of the time like the pilgrimage made universal) with no amendments possible.

You claim the first major instance of elections was from Islam. What about the Greeks, Romans, Magadh and Vaishali in India? All nearly a 1000 years before Islam.

If these great democratic practices were to be found at Islam's inception have you wondered why they petered out quickly? Could it be that these Allah-given institutions were very weak to begin with?

Regards

Plato

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