...... Not confused at all , far from it.

Submitted by The Grand Infidel of Kaffiristan (Australia), Jun 8, 2008 at 01:45

Thank you Mohammed for your kind remarks, however do not expect that such agreeable politeness on your part (uncharacteristic as it is from a Muslim respondent) - is in any way going to deflect me or others from continuing to point out the obvious and fundamental issues

Which are, amongst others,

- that the Islamic religion is a belief system that promotes its own supremacy over all others.

It is He Who hath sent His Messenger with guidance and the Religion of Truth, to proclaim it over all religion, even though the Pagans may detest (it). Sura 9:33 (Yusuf Ali's translation)

Muhammad proclaimed that the so-called "Religion of Truth" (Islam) is supreme over all other religions - did he or did he not? (No taqqiya please)

-has an inbuilt system for gaining and maintaining numercial supremacy of its adherents - it does so by way of stifling thinking deviating from accepted thinking:

It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Messenger to have any option about their decision: if any one disobeys Allah and His Messenger, he is indeed on a clearly wrong Path. Sura 33:36

If anyone contends with the Messenger even after guidance has been plainly conveyed to him, and follows a path other than that becoming to men of Faith, We shall leave him in the path he has chosen, and land him in Hell,- what an evil refuge! Sura 4:115

- also by openly criticising other theologies:

Ye are the best of peoples, evolved for mankind, enjoining what is right, forbidding what is wrong, and believing in Allah. If only the People of the Book had faith, it were best for them: among them are some who have faith, but most of them are perverted transgressors. Sura 3:111

If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good). Sura 3:85 (Yusuf Ali's translation)

- or punishment up to and including death for those who wake up from Islam's hold in. many Muslim countries

http://allafrica.com/stories/200806060879.html

"Use of derogatory remarks, etc; in respect of the Holy Prophet. Whoever by words, either spoken or written or by visible representation, or by any imputation, innuendo, or insinuation, directly or indirectly, defiles the sacred name of the Holy Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) shall be punished with death, or imprisonment for life, and shall also be liable to fine. — Pakistan Penal code: Offenses relating to religion: Section: 295-C

-At it's core, Islam also has a major misunderstanding of the nature of deity and human consciousness and seems to have no concept at all of Enlightenment - which is fundamental to all other religions. The possible excdption to this might be Sufi mystics - who are seen as heretics by many Muslims and have even been persecuted.

-Islam EASILY open to misinterpretation by so many of the world's uneducated masses. Ttherefore is easily used by manipulative individuals bent on amassing personal and/or political power - for whatever reason - financial, political or some confused scheme to get on the good side of their imagination of what 'Allah' is.

-Islam creates divisions n societies by creating a muslim and non-muslim mindset

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jun/01/iraq

-Islam has not demonstrated itself to be a cure-all for any of its societies ills:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/meast/05/20/basra.killings/index.htmlti

-Islam does not actively discourage primitive practices - even amongst Muslim refugess living in advanced Western countries.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/06/06/europe/EU-GEN-Norway-Female-Circumcision.php

That's in marked contract to your glowing report card on what Islam has done for women over the years isn't it?

Now, let's admit that as males ( i am at least) , we can't speak for what Islam has done for women. Others can - such as Ayaan Hirsi Ali. OK, I know she has a fatwa on her and under the threat of death from those who know REALLY what God wants - but even so - her viewpoint as a non-arab female is valuable.

let's have a look at what she has to say:

http://www.resetdoc.org/EN/Hirsi-ali-interview.php

While we're mentioning her , as far as Islamic education goes - I like Hisi Ali's quote:

" ‘I haven't seen anybody coming out of a Catholic or Jewish school advocating violence against women or homosexuals, or wanting to murder innocent people in the name of their religion.'^[

^{You state:".......}and rights which islam gave to women came to europe only after the rennaisance and islam reduced slavery 1429 years ago which was abolished in europe only in 19th century."

That's garbage. Europe was not a seemless whole - and despite the best efforts of the EU bureacrats will never become so. History is littered with European examples of where men and women were seen y each other as being equal particpipants in their societies - eg. Norse and Celtic civilizations.

You state"islam argues its believers to gain knowledge even if ti is from a non-muslim,when the non-muslims were captured after the battle of badar the muslims asked for their knowledge in return of their freedom, and many non-muslims were freed this way."

The question imediately arises - why did such a supposedly advanced and enlightened culture need to take the hard won knowldege of other cultures under duress?

Islam, more than any other religion has been and is responsible for a large amount of violence - because it can be so easily twisted to be whatever the reader wants it to be. Also, many of the stories in the hadiths ARE violent - even the beloved 'Mohammed (no pbuh from me) - the great role model - the 'perfect' man - is responsible for many , many peoples' deaths - on the most spurious of grounds. We won't go in to his sexual exploits which are well-known to most readers (most of which would land anyone in jail in the civilsed world.)

Violence has been and is occurring in most places where the Muslim world rubs up against other civilizations. How can any sane indiidual expect people, who have totally different points of view and traditions to NOT react to Muslims with attitudes ranging from tolerance of them as human beings but supremely misguided individuals (much as you do an insane person ) to outright scorn. Scorn is more appropriate for 'educated' Muslims - ones who SHOULD know better and are able to see the glaring contradictions in what they believe - but do not

While we're on this point, can you tell me which other religious leader was like this?

You state - somewhat condescendingly - " but dear brother do you have any knowledge of quran or the sayings of prophet mohammed(pbuh). "

This is incorrect. I can put together thoussands of passages form the Koran in seconds - as can you I can read them as easily as I can read any other religious book. I can undestand what has been written.

"you all non-muslims believe that islam is a religion of terrorist you believe this because you believe the media (cnn,bbc,etc etc)"

OK, you've got me there. Those planes didn't fly into the World Trade centre buildings. The press releases issued by the Islamic Republic of Iran are only lying when they reported that Iran's hard-line President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said the world would witness the destruction of Israel soon. Musharef - the ex-head of the government of an Islamic state was either lying or had been misquoted by the BBC in this report:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/1824455.stm

You state, regarding Islamic conquerors of parts of India - : "if their intention were to spread islam then there would not have been a single hindu left in india."

I doubt very much whether many Indian readers of this post would agree with that statement. You would of course know that Muslims have not actually won a great many of the battles they have fought - that is especially seen these days in the repeated failed attempts against Israel and against Russians.

" i know that many muslims are living under grinding poverty and many muslims are uneducated "

so do we

"but all this is not because of islam it is because of corrupt governments prevelent in muslim countries that i think are probably sponsored by USA and EUROPE"

That is a good example of how opinion can differ from fact. Corrupt Muslim governments are NOT sponsored by Europe and Europe. The only thing that Europe and the US want from Arab countries is the oil. And they have paid heavily over many, many decades for that. Your Arab Muslim sheiks (yes, even in the most 'holy' of holy countries - Saudi Arabia) have become wealthy beyond imagination 'pure' - and no doubt tell themsleves it if Allah's will that they should be so rich and that somehow the rest of their societies should live as they did in the 7th century. It must somehow assist in keeping Islam 'pure' by keeping the masses uneducated and ignorant and grovelling in primitive religion that is way past its use-by date.

No, Mohammed, some things are self-evident - the sky is blue, ice is cold, grass is green and Muslim actions speak louder than their flowery wishful words. I am not confused at all.

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