just to be "fair"

Submitted by Mr. S D Rodrian (United States), May 11, 2008 at 16:50

fair (Egypt), May 6, 2008 at 12:13 wrote:

> Koran says

> 31.15] And if they contend with you that you should
> associate with Me what you have no knowledge of, do
> not obey them, and keep company with them in this
> world kindly, and follow the way of him who turns to
> Me, then to Me is your return, then will I inform
> you of what you did—

Koran also says before passage above, this:

"31.14": And We have enjoined man in respect of his
parents -- his mother bears him with faintings upon
faintings and his weaning takes two years -- saying:
Be grateful to Me and to both your parents; to Me is
the eventual coming.

And after your quote, this:

"31.24": We give them to enjoy a little, then will
We drive them to a severe chastisement.

Whole passage, put together, mean: If parents
bug you about Allah, say nothing, eventually we
gonna get'em.

> And says

> [18.29]The truth is from your Lord, so let him who
> please believe, and let him who please disbelieve;

Entire verse:

"18.29": And say: The truth is from your Lord, so
let him who please believe, and let him who please
disbelieve; surely We have prepared for the iniquitous
a fire, the curtains of which shall encompass them
about; and if they cry for water, they shall be given
water like molten brass which will scald their faces;
evil the drink and ill the resting-place.

Meaning: Ya may not be able to convince people
to believe, but you can certainly burn them at the
stake for not believing. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!!!

> Also says

> [2.256] There is no compulsion in religion; truly
> the right way has become clearly distinct from
> error; therefore, whoever disbelieves in the Shaitan
> and believes in Allah he indeed has laid hold on the
> firmest handle, which shall not break off, and Allah
> is Hearing, Knowing.

"2.257": Allah is the guardian of those who
believe. He brings them out of the darkness into the
light; and (as to) those who disbelieve, their
guardians are Shaitans who take them out of the light
into the darkness; they are the inmates of the fire,
in it they shall abide.

Meaning: Clearly, "compulsion" means "reasoning."
In effect, "arguing" is moot, Allah is the way and
everything else belongs in the fire.

> and you says

> and where children are encouraged to murder their
> parents, brothers, and sisters ... and it is
> demanded of parents they murder their children if
> they stray from Islamic law). From where you get
> that false info,

From the laws and behavior of every Islamic country
and peoples. From Wikipaedia:

"The four major Sunni and the one major Shia
Madh'hab (schools of Islamic jurisprudence) agree
that a sane adult male apostate must be executed.
They differ on the punishment for a female apostate
- some schools calling for death and others for
imprisonment. Whether Sharia laws governing apostasy
are derived from the hadith traditions alone or also
from the Qu'ran is disputed. According to Wael
Hallaq nothing of the apostasy law are derived from
the Qur'an, although the jurist al-Shafi'i
interpreted the Qu'ranic verse 2:217 as providing
the main evidence for apostasy being a capital crime
in Islam."

I think we can all assume that some of these victims
will be parents and others their children.

Some recent countries such as Egypt and Turkey have
tried to curtail this Islamic zeal, but I recently
read of an Egyptian convert to Christianity who was in
effect expelled from Egypt "for his own good;" and
"secular" Turkey will soon go back to the Islamic dark
ages from whence it comes, with all that entails...

> i suggest that you start reading first, i am living in Egypt and i can assure you that we are living with Christians in peace having Christian neighbor

That is not what I am reading in the newspapers. Instead, I am reading of killings of Coptics by the dozens by Muslim mobs, of the burning of their Churches and other outrages. I suggest, sir, that either you stop being such a self-evident liar, or that you start reading FREE newspapers which actually report what is taking place, and not what your government wants its populace to NOT know.

> And guess what one of the richest families in the
> Forbes list is a Christian family living in Egypt.
> And if you know nothing about the Muslims scientists
> like Avicenna introduced experimental medicine,
> discovered contagious diseases, introduced
> quarantine and clinical trials, and described many
> anaesthetics and medical and therapeutic drugs, in
> The Canon of Medicine. Averroes, founder of the
> Averroism school of philosophy and that The Guinness
> Book of World Records recognizes the University of
> Al Karaouine in Fez, Morocco as the oldest
> degree-granting university in the world with its
> founding in 859 CE. Among the achievements of Muslim
> mathematicians during this period include the
> development of algebra and algorithms by Muhammad
> ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, the invention of spherical
> trigonometry, the addition of the decimal point
> notation to the Arabic numerals, the discovery of
> all the trigonometric functions besides sine,
> al-Kindi's introduction of cryptanalysis and
> frequency analysis, al-Karaji's introduction of
> algebraic calculus and proof by mathematical
> induction, the development of analytic geometry and
> the earliest general formula for infinitesimal and
> integral calculus by Ibn al-Haytham, the beginning
> of algebraic geometry by Omar Khayyam, the first
> refutations of Euclidean geometry and the parallel
> postulate by Nasīr al-Dīn al-Tūsī, the first attempt
> at a non-Euclidean geometry by Sadr al-Din, the
> development of symbolic algebra by Abū al-Hasan ibn
> Alī al-Qalasādī and numerous other advances in
> algebra, arithmetic, calculus, cryptography,
> geometry, number theory and trigonometry. Many other
> advances were made by Muslim scientists in biology
> (anatomy, botany, evolution, physiology and
> zoology), the earth sciences (anthropology,
> cartography, geodesy, geography and geology),
> psychology (experimental psychology, psychiatry,
> psychophysics and psychotherapy), and the social
> sciences (demography, economics, sociology, history
> and historiography). Other famous Muslim scientists
> include al-Farabi (a polymath), Biruni (a polymath
> who was one of the earliest anthropologists and a
> pioneer of geodesy), Nasīr al-Dīn al-Tūsī (a
> polymath), and Ibn Khaldun (considered to be a
> pioneer of several social sciences such as
> demography, economics, cultural history,
> historiography and sociology among others. So was it
> intentionally misleading others or it is lack of
> knowledge?

I ask you the same question, sir. Read this letter:

START QUOTE

What Arab Civilization?

November 7, 2001
Carly Fiorina
Hewlett-Packard
3000 Hanover Street
Palo Alto, CA 94304-1185

Dear Madame Fiorina:

It is with great interest that I read your
speech delivered on September 26, 2001, titled
"Technology, Business and Our way of Life:
What's Next" [sic]. I was particularly
interested in the story you told at the end of
your speech, about the Arab/Muslim civilization.

As an Assyrian, a non-Arab, Christian native of
the Middle East, whose ancestors reach back to
5000 B.C., I wish to clarify some points you
made in this little story, and to alert you to
the dangers of unwittingly being drawn into the
Arabist/Islamist ideology, which seeks to
assimilate all cultures and religions into the
Arab/Islamic fold.

I know you are a very busy woman, but please
find ten minutes to read what follows, as it is
a perspective that you will not likely get from
anywhere else. I will answer some of the
specific points you made in your speech, then
conclude with a brief perspective on this
Arabist/Islamist ideology.

Arabs and Muslims appeared on the world scene in
630 A.D., when the armies of Muhammad began
their conquest of the Middle East. We should be
very clear that this was a military conquest,
not a missionary enterprise, and through the use
of force, authorized by a declaration of a Jihad
against infidels, Arabs/Muslims were able to
forcibly convert and assimilate non-Arabs and
non-Mulsims into their fold. Very few indigenous
communities of the Middle East survived this --
primarily Assyrians, Jews, Armenians and Coptics
(of Egypt).

Having conquered the Middle East, Arabs placed
these communities under a Dhimmi (see the book
Dhimmi, by Bat Ye'Or) system of governance,
where the communities were allowed to rule
themselves as religious minorities (Christians,
Jews and Zoroastrian). These communities had to
pay a tax (called a Jizzya in Arabic) that was,
in effect, a penalty for being non-Muslim, and
that was typically 80% in times of tolerance and
up to 150% in times of oppression. This tax
forced many of these communities to convert to
Islam, as it was designed to do.

You state, "its architects designed buildings
that defied gravity." I am not sure what you are
referring to, but if you are referring to domes
and arches, the fundamental architectural
breakthrough of using a parabolic shape instead
of a spherical shape for these structures was
made by the Assyrians more than 1300 years
earlier, as evidenced by their archaeological
record.

You state, "its mathematicians created the
algebra and algorithms that would enable the
building of computers, and the creation of
encryption." The fundamental basis of modern
mathematics had been laid down not hundreds but
thousands of years before by Assyrians and
Babylonians, who already knew of the concept of
zero, of the Pythagorean Theorem, and of many,
many other developments expropriated by
Arabs/Muslims (see History of Babylonian
Mathematics, Neugebauer).

You state, "its doctors examined the human body,
and found new cures for disease." The
overwhelming majority of these doctors (99%)
were Assyrians. In the fourth, fifth, and sixth
centuries Assyrians began a systematic
translation of the Greek body of knowledge into
Assyrian. At first they concentrated on the
religious works but then quickly moved to
science, philosophy and medicine. Socrates,
Plato, Aristotle, Galen, and many others were
translated into Assyrian, and from Assyrian into
Arabic. It is these Arabic translations which
the Moors brought with them into Spain, and
which the Spaniards translated into Latin and
spread throughout Europe, thus igniting the
European Renaissance.

By the sixth century A.D., Assyrians had begun
exporting back to Byzantia their own works on
science, philosophy and medicine. In the field
of medicine, the Bakhteesho Assyrian family
produced nine generations of physicians, and
founded the great medical school at Gundeshapur
(Iran). Also in the area of medicine, (the Assyrian)
Hunayn ibn-Ishaq's textbook on ophthalmology,
written in 950 A.D., remained the authoritative
source on the subject until 1800 A.D.

In the area of philosophy, the Assyrian
philosopher Job of Edessa developed a physical
theory of the universe, in the Assyrian
language, that rivaled Aristotle's theory, and
that sought to replace matter with forces (a
theory that anticipated some ideas in quantum
mechanics, such as the spontaneous creation and
destruction of matter that occurs in the quantum
vacuum).

One of the greatest Assyrian achievements of the
fourth century was the founding of the first
university in the world, the School of Nisibis,
which had three departments, theology,
philosophy and medicine, and which became a
magnet and center of intellectual development in
the Middle East. The statutes of the School of
Nisibis, which have been preserved, later became
the model upon which the first Italian
university was based (see The Statutes of the
School of Nisibis, by Arthur Voobus).

When Arabs and Islam swept through the Middle
East in 630 A.D., they encountered 600 years of
Assyrian Christian civilization, with a rich
heritage, a highly developed culture, and
advanced learning institutions. It is this
civilization that became the foundation of the
Arab civilization.

You state, "Its astronomers looked into the
heavens, named the stars, and paved the way for
space travel and exploration." This is a bit
melodramatic. In fact, the astronomers you refer
to were not Arabs but Chaldeans and Babylonians
(of present day south-Iraq), who for millennia
were known as astronomers and astrologers, and
who were forcibly Arabized and Islamized -- so
rapidly that by 750 A.D. they had disappeared
completely.

You state, "its writers created thousands of
stories. Stories of courage, romance and magic.
Its poets wrote of love, when others before them
were too steeped in fear to think of such
things." There is very little literature in the
Arabic language that comes from this period you
are referring to (the Koran is the only
significant piece of literature), whereas the
literary output of the Assyrians and Jews was
vast. The third largest corpus of Christian
writing, after Latin and Greek, is by the
Assyrians in the Assyrian language (also called
Syriac); see:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14408a.htm

You state, "when other nations were afraid of
ideas, this civilization thrived on them, and
kept them alive. When censors threatened to wipe
out knowledge from past civilizations, this
civilization kept the knowledge alive, and
passed it on to others." This is a very
important issue you raise, and it goes to the
heart of the matter of what Arab/Islamic
civilization represents. I reviewed a book

http://www.aina.org/aol/peter/greek.htm

titled How Greek Science Passed to the Arabs, in
which the author lists the significant
translators and interpreters of Greek science.
Of the 22 scholars listed, 20 were Assyrians, 1
was Persian and 1 an Arab. I state at the end of
my review: "The salient conclusion which can be
drawn from O'Leary's book is that Assyrians
played a significant role in the shaping of the
Islamic world via the Greek corpus of knowledge.
If this is so, one must then ask the question,
what happened to the Christian communities which
made them lose this great intellectual
enterprise which they had established. One can
ask this same question of the Arabs. Sadly,
O'Leary's book does not answer this question,
and we must look elsewhere for the answer." I
did not answer this question I posed in the
review because it was not the place to answer
it, but the answer is very clear, the Christian
Assyrian community was drained of its population
through forced conversion to Islam (by the
Jizzya), and once the community had dwindled
below a critical threshold, it ceased producing
the scholars that were the intellectual driving
force of the Islamic civilization, and that is
when the so called "Golden Age of Islam" came to
an end (about 850 A.D.).

Islam the religion itself was significantly
molded by Assyrians and Jews (see Nestorian
Influence on Islam and Hagarism: the Making of
the Islamic World).

Arab/Islamic civilization is not a progressive
force, it is a regressive force; it does not
give impetus, it retards. The great civilization
you describe was not an Arab/Muslim
accomplishment, it was an Assyrian
accomplishment that Arabs expropriated and
subsequently lost when they drained, through the
forced conversion of Assyrians to Islam, the
source of the intellectual vitality that
propelled it. What other Arab/Muslim
civilization has risen since? What other
Arab/Muslim successes can we cite?

You state, "and perhaps we can learn a lesson
from his [Suleiman] example: It was leadership
based on meritocracy, not inheritance. It was
leadership that harnessed the full capabilities
of a very diverse population that included
Christianity, Islamic, and Jewish traditions."

In fact, the Ottomans were extremely oppressive
to non-Muslims. For example, young Christian
boys were forcefully taken from their families,
usually at the age of 8-10, and inducted into
the Janissaries, (yeniceri in Turkish) where
they were Islamized and made to fight for the
Ottoman state. What literary, artistic or
scientific achievements of the Ottomans can we
point to? We can, on the other hand, point to
the genocide of 750,000 Assyrians, 1.5 million
Armenians and 400,000 Greeks in World War One
by the Kemalist "Young Turk" government. This is
the true face of Islam.

Arabs/Muslims are engaged in an explicit
campaign of destruction and expropriation of
cultures and communities, identities and ideas.
Wherever Arab/Muslim civilization encounters a
non-Arab/Muslim one, it attempts to destroy it
(as the Buddhist statues in Afghanistan were
destroyed, as Persepolis was destroyed by the
Ayotollah Khomenie). This is a pattern that has
been recurring since the advent of Islam, 1400
years ago, and is amply substantiated by the
historical record. If the "foreign" culture
cannot be destroyed, then it is expropriated,
and revisionist historians claim that it is and
was Arab, as is the case of most of the Arab
"accomplishments" you cited in your speech. For
example, Arab history texts in the Middle East
teach that Assyrians were Arabs, a fact that no
reputable scholar would assert, and that no
living Assyrian would accept. Assyrians first
settled Nineveh, one of the major Assyrian
cities, in 5000 B.C., which is 5630 years before
Arabs came into that area. Even the word 'Arab'
is an Assyrian word, meaning "Westerner" (the
first written reference to Arabs was by the
Assyrian King Sennacherib, 800 B.C., in which
he tells of conquering the "ma'rabayeh" --
Westerners. See The Might That Was Assyria, by
H. W. F. Saggs).

Even in America this Arabization policy

http://aina.org/releases/2001/arabization.htm

continues. On October 27th a coalition of seven
Assyrian and Maronite organizations sent an
official letter

http://www.aina.org/releases/2001/caamletter.htm

to the Arab American Institute asking it to stop
identifying Assyrians and Maronites as Arabs,
which it had been deliberately doing.

There are minorities and nations struggling for
survival in the Arab/Muslim ocean of the Middle
East and Africa (Assyrians, Armenians, Coptics,
Jews, southern Sudanese, Ethiopians,
Nigerians...), and we must be very sensitive not
to unwittingly and inadvertently support Islamic
fascism and Arab Imperialism, with their
attempts to wipe out all other cultures,
religions and civilizations. It is incumbent
upon each one of us to do our homework and
research when making statements and speeches
about these sensitive matters.

I hope you found this information enlightening.
For more information, refer to the web links
below. You may contact me at

k...@ninevehsoft.com for further questions.

Thank you for your consideration.

END QUOTE

Think for a minute: Is it reasonable to assume that
Muhammed's cutthroats gave rise to all the brilliant
civilization you mentioned within a few generations?
And, with the victory of Islam, where did all those
same brilliant achievements go? Is it reasonable to
assume that the same men who brought them about also
stood by as they vanished into the sands of history?!
The history of non-Muslims is one of advancement
while the history of Muslims is one of degradation:
I know that your leaders blame non-Muslims for this,
usually the Jews, but how long will you live without
any brains?

Then re-read the letter above. For, even if you have
no idea which of the two versions of history is the
true one, that latter one must surely sound even to you
like what really must have happened. Am I not right?
Come on, admit it now. VISIT:

http://islamisbad.com

S D Rodrian
http://poems.sdrodrian.com
http://thesolutionisthis.com
http://mp3.sdrodrian.com

All religions are local.
Only science is universal.

---

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