Mansoor: You must read ayat carefully and not just in context I

Submitted by Plato (India), Mar 24, 2008 at 12:19

Mansoor, you wrote:

>>Poor Plato!! you are the most unluckiest… You said "No ambiguities? Read 3:7…….

In above Verse it is clearly revealed about the secret of the terms Alf Lam Meem, Alif Lam Ra, Ya-Sin and other terms like that, can only be known by those who are firmly rooted with knowledge....<<

Mansoor, you should take care to read the whole ayat and not read it up to only the truncated sentence I have given to save space. All that the Shakir translation is saying is that men firmly rooted in knowledge say all of the Koran is from Allah and NOT that men of understanding know the meaning of the whole Koran. The entire verse reads in three translations as follows:

003.007 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/)
YUSUFALI: He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book: In it are verses basic or fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the Book: others are allegorical. But those in whose hearts is perversity follow the part thereof that is allegorical, seeking discord, and searching for its hidden meanings, but no one knows its hidden meanings except Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say: "We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord:" and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.
PICKTHAL: ….- they are the substance of the Book - and others (which are) allegorical. But those in whose hearts is doubt pursue, forsooth, that which is allegorical seeking (to cause) dissension by seeking to explain it. None knoweth its explanation save Allah. And those who are of sound instruction say: We believe therein; the whole is from our Lord; but only men of understanding really heed.
SHAKIR: ……..decisive, they are the basis of the Book, and others are allegorical; then as for those in whose hearts there is perversity they follow the part of it which is allegorical, seeking to mislead and seeking to give it (their own) interpretation. but none knows its interpretation except Allah, and those who are firmly rooted in knowledge say: We believe in it, it is all from our Lord; and none do mind except those having understanding.

Read carefully the underlined words in the three translations. All three say no one knows the meaning of these allegorical verses EXCEPT ALLAH. All three translations have ruled out anybody knowing the meanings except Allah. Both Pickthal and Shakir are clear that only people of understanding are careful to follow (heed/mind) verses which are the foundation/substance/basis of the Koran. And why is that? Because they know the other verses' (whichever they are, and only Allah know them!) meaning is known only to Allah.

Now go back and read the words in italics. All three clearly say that perverse people follow the allegorical ones (how this is possible when Allah has not revealed which they are is left your imagination).

Clearly this means that Allah is telling you that men of understanding do not seek to follow the verses which are allegorical unlike the perverse people. It is not saying that men of understanding know the meaning of all the allegorical verses. Allah has already ruled that out by saying that only He understands their meaning.

Therefore Yusuf Ali has got it wrong by translating ‘none will grasp the Message except men of understanding' as Allah has previously ruled out that possibility.

Now, Mansoor, as a man of understanding who understands the Koran can you prove that I am wrong. And while you are at it let us also know the meaning of those alphabets at the beginning of some aya.

>>....People like you who are predetermined to observe the table upside down are not sane enough to understand the logic. I have full sympathy with you!!!<<

I appreciate your sympathising with me for having taken leave of my senses and being illogical. The verse we have examined are a good example of Allah's great powers of logic. He sends down verses to His prophet some of whose meanings are clear and others which are allegorical, but He fails to inform us which the unclear ones are. But yet he expects men of understanding to understand which the clear ones are. Also Allah is quite sure that the perverse ones will follow the unclear ones. Allah's logic has my head spinning. Mansoor, as you are a man of understanding please help me here with good Islamic logic.

>>Many places in Quran these terms are use. For your Kind information these ambiguous words are called "Loh-e-Qurani".<<

You kindly inform us that there are ambiguous words in the Koran and tell us that they have a name. How does giving them a nice sounding name help us to solve the ambiguity? Allah has clearly said that no one except He knows what the words mean. Don't even try, Allah will be furious.

>>…These words are of multiple Importance and are believed to be the codes of different tablets in which Quranic verses are preserved.

Mansoor, you forget that the Koran claims in many places that it is a clear book in which there is no doubt (let us pass over 3:7 for the moment). Now you are telling us that it has words in it of MULTIPLE IMPORTANCE which are SUPPOSEDLY codes of some kind. Do you see a contradiction here. Something of multiple importance in a clear book is in code form which no one can read. So what is it doing in Korans on earth?

And you say this is ONLY a belief. You also say there are multiple tablets in which the Koran is preserved. Where? In different safes in heaven? Is Allah worried that some mischievous angel might play with it and destroy it and if there was only one copy in Allah's safe all the copies on earth will also be destroyed? My insanity is growing.

>> Sometimes you have passwords or identification numbers which in actual don't have any meanings but they are used to open or to enter the protected files or folders in your computer.<<

So for whom are these codes meant for? If for Allah, it proves He has a very poor memory. Who is going to try and sneak into Paradise to steal the Koran? Could a rogue angel sneak one out of Heaven? If so what happens to Allah's claim to look into the future? Satan has no entry.

>>Quran used the term Loh-e-Mahfooz, which can be see with the meanings of Hard Disk…… I am proud that Quran is showing us and proving us that the technology much advance which ……..so sophisticatedly created billions and billions of years before. I hope this time you would again shout and say something out of sanity!!!

Mansoor, it would help my sanity if you can tell me who Allah has intended this code for. If Allah has created this password to the tablets he has preserved what chance does anyone have to hack it?? Can Allah not memorise a password trillions of characters rather than take a chance with hackers giving passwords only a few letters long?

Even an insane person like me could have told the Creator not to put in those code words in the Koran He revealed so that no one would have a chance of breaking and entering his Koran. And all the while I thought the Koran was meant to make things clear for us on this earth. Oh Well. This time you have really driven me insane.

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