It's Politics; NOT Religion.

Submitted by Bob Sheehan (United States), Jul 31, 2002 at 16:40

I understand your position and commentary totally. However, the vast majority of Americans have no clue about "monothesim" let alone Islam. To the American public, I am convinced that almost "all" believe that all Bibles are the same. Very few know that the Catholic bible varies from the Methodist bible, varies from the Mormon bible, etc, etc.. Well, the same holds true in Islam. The various sects within Islam, same as the various sects within Christianity and Judaism, have various interpretations of the holiest of books. Torah-Bible-Quran. Why? Simply stated..........To Fit The Needs Of Those In Power At The Time. No more, No less. It is purely political, period!

You and I both know that the Quran of the Shiite's is different thatn the Quran of the Whahabbi of Saudi Arabia. And it goes on and on. A perfect example of this is your statement of the Quran, Surra 5 verse 85, is realy Surra 5 verse 82 in my Quran and mine states as follows....................(by the way, Surra 5 is called "The Feast").......

Apathy Condemned

[5:79] They did not enjoin one another from committing evil. Miserable indeed is what they did.

[5:80] You would see many of them allying themselves with those who disbelieve. Miserable indeed is what their hands have sent forth on behalf of their souls. GOD is angry with them and, consequently, they will abide forever in retribution.

[5:81] Had they believed in GOD, and the prophet, and in what was revealed to him herein, they would not have befriended them. But many of them are evil.

A Statement of Fact

[5:82] You will find that the worst enemies of the believers are the Jews and the idol worshipers. And you will find that the closest people in friendship to the believers are those who say, "We are Christian." This is because they have priests and monks among them, and they are not arrogant.

[5:83] When they hear what was revealed to the messenger, you see their eyes flooding with tears as they recognize the truth therein, and they say, "Our Lord, we have believed, so count us among the witnesses.

[5:84] "Why should we not believe in GOD, and in the truth that has come to us, and hope that our Lord may admit us with the righteous people?"

[5:85] GOD has rewarded them for saying this; He will admit them into gardens with flowing streams. They abide therein forever. Such is the reward for the righteous.

[5:86] As for those who disbelieve and reject our revelations, they are the dwellers of Hell.

Quite frankly Mr. Pipes, the real problem in any argument is that the person arguing picks out only one thing to reinfore hi/her point and ignores all facts surrounding it. Surra 5 must be read and understood in its entirey and only then will any one given verse make perfectly logical sense.

In your quote of Surra 9 verse 5, you quote it as " Then fight and slay the pagans wherever you find them. And seize them, beleaguer them and lie in wait for them."

But in my version of the Quran, Surra 9 verse 5 states "Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. "

I believe these two comparisons are quite different; don't you?
Now, let us put just a few of the surrounding verses in with this and we have..........

[9:1] An ultimatum is herein issued from GOD and His messenger to the idol worshipers who enter into a treaty with you.

[9:2] Therefore, roam the earth freely for four months, and know that you cannot escape from GOD, and that GOD humiliates the disbelievers.

[9:3] A proclamation is herein issued from GOD and His messenger to all the people on the great day of pilgrimage, that GOD has disowned the idol worshipers, and so did His messenger. Thus, if you repent, it would be better for you. But if you turn away, then know that you can never escape from GOD. Promise those who disbelieve a painful retribution.

[9:4] If the idol worshipers sign a peace treaty with you, and do not violate it, nor band together with others against you, you shall fulfill your treaty with them until the expiration date. GOD loves the righteous.

[9:5] Once the Sacred Months are past, (and they refuse to make peace) you may kill the idol worshipers when you encounter them, punish them, and resist every move they make. If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), you shall let them go. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.

[9:6] If one of the idol worshipers sought safe passage with you, you shall grant him safe passage, so that he can hear the word of GOD, then send him back to his place of security. That is because they are people who do not know.

[9:7] How can the idol worshipers demand any pledge from GOD and from His messenger? Exempted are those who have signed a peace treaty with you at the Sacred Masjid. If they honor and uphold such a treaty, you shall uphold it as well. GOD loves the righteous.

[9:8] How can they (demand a pledge) when they never observed any rights of kinship between you and them, nor any covenant, if they ever had a chance to prevail. They pacified you with lip service, while their hearts were in opposition, and most of them are wicked.

[9:9] They traded away GOD's revelations for a cheap price. Consequently, they repulsed the people from His path. Miserable indeed is what they did!

[9:10] They never observe any rights of kinship towards any believer, nor do they uphold their covenants; these are the real transgressors.

Repentance: Cleaning the Slate

[9:11] If they repent and observe the Contact Prayers (Salat) and give the obligatory charity (Zakat), then they are your brethren in religion. We thus explain the revelations for people who know.

[9:12] If they violate their oaths after pledging to keep their covenants, and attack your religion, you may fight the leaders of paganism - you are no longer bound by your covenant with them - that they may refrain.

[9:13] Would you not fight people who violated their treaties, tried to banish the messenger, and they are the ones who started the war in the first place? Are you afraid of them? GOD is the One you are supposed to fear, if you are believers.

[9:14] You shall fight them, for GOD will punish them at your hands, humiliate them, grant you victory over them, and cool the chests of the believers.

[9:15] He will also remove the rage from the believers' hearts. GOD redeems whomever He wills. GOD is Omniscient, Most Wise.

Does this not now take on a differnt flavor and understanding?


Why doesn't someone tell the American public about Surra 5 verse 69 and repeated in Surra 2 verse 62 which states................

"Surely, those who believe, those who are Jewish,
the Christians the converts; anyone who
(1) believes in GOD and
(2) believes in the Hereafter, and
(3) leads a righteous life,
will receive their recompense from their Lord;
they have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve."

Also, why doesn't someone simply explain the "Islam" is an Arabic word for "Submission" and those that follow the religion of "Submission" are "Submitters" which is the English translation of the Arabic word "Muslim".

Very pure and simple.

Go ahead and tell the public, and I mean every person in the world, that Hadith and Sunna, interjected in the original versions of the Torah, Bible and Quran, has corrupted all three Holy Books to such an extent, that one sect of followers will continually war with the other sects of followers. Quite frankly, it is no difference than Democrats fighting with Republicans. Rarely if ever will these people agree.

Thank you for hearing me out.
Bob Sheehan............An Irish-Roman Catholic-Muslim...........(a believer and submitter).

---

Note: Opinions expressed in comments are those of the authors alone and not necessarily those of Daniel Pipes. Original writing only, please. Comments are screened and in some cases edited before posting. Reasoned disagreement is welcome but not comments that are scurrilous, off-topic, commercial, disparaging religions, or otherwise inappropriate. For complete regulations, see the "Guidelines for Reader Comments".