To Syed: Not bewildered? Befuddled maybe?

Submitted by Plato (United Arab Emirates), Jul 13, 2007 at 04:41

Syed, your reply to Lenn is befuddling. Let me see if I can throw some light on your comments.

You are a great one for asking references but you yourself provide none. You admit people who follow Islam also lie a lot. So why did not a religion taught to Muslims by Allah the all-powerful prevent them from lying? Is Allah such a poor teacher. There is nothing to show that Muslims lie less than people of other faiths. So Islam fails on this count.

Here is one reference for your demand to show that Allah was one of many gods the Arabs worshipped:

'...The evidence reveals that the temple of the Moon-god was active even in the Christian era. Evidence gathered from both North and South Arabia demonstrate that Moon-god worship was clearly active even in Muhammad's day and was still the dominant cult. According to numerous inscriptions, while the name of the Moon-god was Sin, his title was al- ilah, i.e. "the deity," meaning that he was the chief or high god among the gods. As Coon pointed out, "The god Il or Ilah was originally a phase of the Moon God." The Moon-god was called al- ilah, i.e. the god, which was shortened to Allah in pre-Islamic times. The pagan Arabs even used Allah in the names they gave to their children. For example, both Muhammad's father and uncle had Allah as part of their names.

The fact that they were given such names by their pagan parents proves that Allah was the title for the Moon-god even in Muhammad's day. Prof. Coon goes on to say, "Similarly, under Mohammed's tutelage, the relatively anonymous Ilah, became Al-Ilah, The God, or Allah, the Supreme Being."

This fact answers the questions, "Why is Allah never defined in the Qur'an? Why did Muhammad assume that the pagan Arabs already knew who Allah was?" Muhammad was raised in the religion of the Moon-god Allah. But he went one step further than his fellow pagan Arabs. While they believed that Allah, i.e. the Moon-god, was the greatest of all gods and the supreme deity in a pantheon of deities, Muhammad decided that Allah was not only the greatest god but the only god.....' (http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/moongod.htm)

My dear Sayed Islam does not provide for the simple life. It continously entices you with visions of a sybaritic paradise. It also allows you to take booty and loot conquored people and deprive them of their livelihood as happened to the Banu Qaynuka and Banu Nadir. It's founder went on raids to loot caravans all his life in Medina. He distributed looted wealth including women, camels and other goods to his followers as explicitly allowed for in the Koran. Why did he not consider that he was depriving the women of their freedom, their families and the looted people of their livelihood? If he wanted to set an example of a simple life why instead of looting other people's wealth did he not encourage his followers to work hard and create their own wealth?

You also claim simple life means egoless personality. But what is the example of your Allah and his Rasool? Allah is a Being with a gigantic ego. He needs His praise to be sung all the time. The Prophet needs to have his name stapled to Allah's in the shahada. He wanted his followers to love and respect not only himself but all his family too. He possessed slaves and had a large harem. An egoless person would dispense with such worldly goods.

Your giving examples of women being raped and killed in free countries is ridiculous. How does that justify raping and killing of women in Islamic countries? Should not raping and killing of women almost disappear in Muslim countries if Muslims believe in Islam and as it is Allah's religion and it supposedly guides you in all matters. Claiming that sharia is not implemented anywhere is a cop out. What is important is belief and Islamic countries have believers. And do not forget the fact that statistics of such crimes are not easily available in Muslim countries because they lack even elementary freedoms.

Saying that women are also killed in non-Muslim countries is another cop out. So are children and so are men. But the big difference is women in Islamic countries are killed for religious reasons. For being in love or making love. For being disobedient. For exposing their bodies. For family honour. And so on.If you say the burka is not prescribed by the Koran and Mohammed how is it that in the large majority of Muslim countries women end up wearing one and in many are even fored to wear it? Are you saying that most of your ulema have got it all wrong, that they are misreading the Koran and Mohammed? How can Allah's words be so badly misunderstood by His followers?

Female circumcision is not recommended by the Koran. Nor is male circumcision. So why are all Muslim males circumcised? If that bit of flesh is so abhorent to Allah why did He give it to us in the first place?

You keep playing the numbers game with death. You throw out a figure for killings done by Jews (how many did they kill??) and Christians. But you avoid mentioning any figures for killings by Muslims, why is that. As I pointed out to you in another post if you tote up the figures you are sure to end up with a number which will exceed the Christian figure.

Many times it has been pointed out that the verse in the Koran about killing one innocent being equivalent to the whole of humanity applies only to the Jews. Don't chop up the verse to suit your purpose. It does not apply to Muslims because for Allah anyone who does not follow Him is not innocent and so may be killed or humiliated.

And how many did the Buddhists kill. How many did the Hindus kill. You must admit the figures for these two religions will be miniscule compared to Muslim killings. Why don't you then consider these religions to to be truer than Islam as they bring less death and destruction than Islam?

Before considering the calamity caused by interest-based banks consider the calamity caused in Muslim countries by Islam (the Lal Masjid near you must be fresh in your memory). A full fifty per cent of humanity has been made into second rate humans (women).Can any calamity be worse than this? All non-believers are considered najees, can be forced to pay a humiliation tax and are condemned to hell.

Syed, your country was created almost exclusively by Muslims for Muslims. Why is there so much violence there. Why do the ulema preach violence. Can you keep on blaming the US or India for what is essentially the preaching of the Koran which calls for violence against non-believers. Instead of closing your eyes to what the Koran preaches why don't you open it to the anti-life message of the Koran. The Koran keeps on telling us, and as you keep repeating, the here after is the prize to be desired. And to achive that desire the Koran threatens and pleads with its followers to go out and kill or be killed. You want me to quote the verses that spell this out, Syed Rafey?

As a Pakistani you must be familiar with what they teach you in your school. You must be aware that your history books and religious lessons are guaranteed to generate hatred in young minds for people of other faiths. The violence you see in your country is the direct result of what is drummed into young minds in your country. Religion has poisoned your people's minds and they kill or are killed in the cause of Allah and his Rasool.

Read what some concerned Pakistanis themselves have to say about the kind of brain-washing that is done in your Islamic country. Perhaps you recall some of the lessons your teachers inculcated in you

Here are a few paras I have cut and pasted to give you a taste of what the report contains:

A close analysis by a group of independent scholars shows that for over two decades the curricula and the officially mandated textbooks in these subjects have contained material that is directly contrary to the goals and values of a progressive, moderate and democratic Pakistan.

The March 2002 revision of curricula undertaken by the Curriculum Wing of the Ministry of Education did not address the problems that existed in earlier curriculum documents.

In some cases, these problems are now even worse.

Our analysis found that some of the most significant problems in the current curricula

and textbooks are:

1.

significance of actual events in our history.

Inaccuracies of fact and omissions that serve to substantially distort the nature and

2.

Insensitivity to the existing religious diversity of the nation

3.

Incitement to militancy and violence, including encouragement of Jehad and

Shahadat

4.

citizens, especially women and religious minorities, and other towards nations.

Perspectives that encourage prejudice, bigotry and discrimination towards fellow

5.

A glorification of war and the use of force

6.

Omission of concepts, events and material that could encourage critical selfawareness among students

'...Four themes emerge most strongly as constituting the bulk of the curricula and textbooks of the three compulsory subjects.

1. that Pakistan is for Muslims alone;

2. that Islamic teachings, including a compulsory reading and memorization of Qur'an,

are to be included in all the subjects, hence to be forcibly taught to all the students,

whatever their faith,;

3. that Ideology of Pakistan is to be internalized as faith, and that hate be created against Hindus and India; and

4. students are to be urged to take the path of

Jehad and Shahadat.....'

'....The textbooks then respond in the following way to the above curriculum instructions:

Hindu has always been an enemy of Islam.

102

The religion of the Hindus did not teach them good things -- Hindus did not

respect women...

103

Hindus worship in temples which are very narrow and dark places, where they

worship idols. Only one person can enter the temple at a time. In our mosques,

on the other hand, all Muslims can say their prayers together.

104

‘ … the social evils of the Hindus'

105

Hindus thought that there was no country other than India, nor any people other

than the Indians, nor did anyone else possess any knowledge

(

This report is necessary reading for all Pakistanis concerned with its future. The Lal Masjid incident is a direct result of the violence that is inculcated in young Pakistani minds.

regards

Plato

106.....'www.sdpi.org/whats_new/reporton/State%20of%20Curr&TextBooks.pdf )

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