Countering Nura once again

Submitted by Straight_Talk_Luigi (United States), Feb 15, 2009 at 01:13

By your argument, why is Italy, America, U.K. ect called Christian nations?

The United States has a Seperation of Church and State clause in the Constitution. I hardly deem that grounds for a Christian nation, but you will get different answers from different people.

Nearly 40-50% of people in the UK (including thousands of former Muslims) are non-religious or atheist.

Italy is well over 90% Catholic, but most of the women there do not plan on having children.

Neither the UK nor Italy have laws specifically governing religion, except for the natural laws banning rape and murder that some Muslims there justify through Islam. Care to explain that to me, or maybe you just don't care since you are on the warpath against us?

All of these nations have a substantial amount of other religions unlike Malaysia, Indonesia, Saudi Arabia, ect. Who have overwhelming Muslim populations?

Nice try, Nura, but I've seen the predictions. You know that Western Europe will soon be mostly Muslim this century as well as I do, and you love it.

I blame who is blameworthy. Why should the evils of other nations be forgotten or not spoken of, while Muslims are being demonized.

Simple: Because Muslims are not being demonized. Sorry if Dr. Pipes and myself are too intelligent and have enough self-respect not to be cultural a** kissers like the left-wing apologists you seem to deal with.

In Western countries, Nura, Muslims have more special rights than other religion or ethnic group. I guess all that whining and terrorism does pay dividends. It's probably why your people (FAKE Muslims) keep doing it.

I remember how Islam was spread. It was spread to me and my family through indoctrination.

I kinda figured you were arrogant, but I never knew you were so weak-minded as to be controlled.

How do you think the community in Medina grew? Through war?

Medina is the exception. Your ancestors were not so kind in their dealings in Central Asia, Asia Minor and Africa. Not to mention the rest of Arabia.

Just in case you forgot, every Muslim who fount against pagans were once pagans themselves. They were of the same tribes and families. They converted to Islam willingly and fought for the freedom of their religion. This is how Islam propelled.

They were conquered and subjected by superior military forces who were better organized and believed in something. That is part of your standard template for civilization conquest. Islam held the advantage due its organzational roots in the true faith of Catholicism and previously Judiasm. Willingly? You make me laugh, Nura. Is that what they tell you in the mosque?

In case you forgot, during the British occupation of Palestine, Zionist had already begun there agenda to take over. Zionism is actually older than both wars, the agenda remained the same. Israel was not officially a state until after the 2^nd war, but they had already occupied the land to be able to even call themselves a state.

Actually, the area was under British control, whether the Zionists liked it or not, it was governed from London. The fact their ideology was present is not an excuse because they had no external recognition.

Europeans were just more bloodthirsty you should say. The "same thing" was not happening all over the world at this time.

Actually, they were more so after resources than killing Muslims. I'm sorry, I realize whenever I argue this it completely nullifies any argument coming from a sniveling minority, but all the settlement patterns and historical data support this.

Europeans were just better equipped, resistant to more diseases, had more organized strategy and believed in themselves and their cause.

As far as the places they conquered: Historically, Nura, most wars and conflicts have occurred between neighboring states. You really need to look at history from an objective point of view, and for someone who claims to be Muslim (personally, I think you've just hijacked their religion since it gives you something to whine about), you sure have a lot of work to do on discplining your passions, young lady!

You have no idea of who "my" ancestors are. My ancestors were the victims of the American slave trade, another subject and black mark on the civilized Christian world.

Let's talk about this, shall we: Your ancestors betrayed each other. Some served as guides into the African deserts and rainforest to find all these people. The territory was hostile to Europeans to say the least.

Also, it's my understanding that Christians got the idea of enslaving Africans from the Arabs.

I also hate to break it to you, but dark-skinned West Africans were not the only people enslaved. In fact, Muslims from North Africa enslaved several million Europeans--as far as Iceland. Sickening, really, knowing their vile hands and doctrine touched such innocent and beautiful people, much as the case with your ancestors. It even got to a point where Mediterannean peoples were too afraid to live near the coasts.

Oh, and BTW, they also did cross the Sahara and pick up a few of your ancestors too.

If this were truly a communtive justice issue, you would be sore with Saudi Arabia and the Sudan, who still practice slavery. Sad thing is, Nura, Christians are doing more for these people than Muslims are! Ignoring their own! How honourable is that?

I guess Muslims should have been "better", at war and conquering is what you mean. I think that many Jihadists agree with this statement.

WE are not guilty of anything but what our own hands have done.

Then stop whining about slavery. You're starting to sound like a couple of left-wing Protestant, African-American ministers I've come to know. You have a debate club trophy, so live up to it!

What happened to Christians in North Africa? They are still there and in the rest of the Arab world as they HAVE ALWAYS BEEN!!

They are subjated and persecuted, especially when they do their God-given duty and convert Muslims. The treatment they recieve is unacceptable.

Christians and Jews have never left the holy land.

They are now, and the ones who stay are persecuted. You won't force them out, but you'll make life so difficult for them they'll want to leave.

They were never expelled or persecuted! These are blatant lies.

They are wherever there is sharia law. Sharia law itself means persecution for anyone who does not follow your sick, twisted view of Islam. Sharia is a man-made control device made up by Arab men who were ignorant and fearful.

Where is the Muslim portrayed holocaust on Christians and Jews? In fact, it was Muslims who protected Arab Christians and Jews from Europeans.

Your brethren in Iran were ALLIES with the AXIS powers! That is your mark! People who think like you even carry signs that say God Bless Hilter in Europe and they are Muslims!

The crusaders killed 1000s of Jews before they reached the holy land! Arab Christians were raped and killed by their "brothers" in faith. You will not find the equivalent in Muslim history.

The Crusades were started as a defensive war for those who followed the one, true faith of Catholcism. The rest were raiding our villages and killing innocent people.

Don't even try to convince me you actually care about Arab Christians, either. You want us all dead, and you've made that clear by your posts.

There nothing the same about European expansion.

As I said, it's not my fault the Europeans were more advanced and better equipped than you were. Maybe if you had actually gotten your noses out of your radical doctrine and found the Love of Jesus, it would have never happened.

So eloquently put. Muslims are forbidden to fight Muslims. I guess the issue is more complicated than that huh?

Somewhat. They just don't follow that rule. Especially in Palestine. They'll kill Muslims by the billions to achieve their ends.

Have you been living in cave or something? Most of the casulties in Iraq are from terrorists doing justice in the name of Allah while they TRY and harm brave, noble, respectful soldiers of America and other countries.

I rarely visit the mosque, so no.

I see. So like bin-laden, you just use Islam to whine and complain and justify violence. The spirtual side is not important then?

Any sane nation would have opposed the Iraq war.

LOL..actually, the countries that opposed the war had something themselves to gain. You have a lot to learn about how and why states act, Nura. Always in their best interests, even the Muslim ones. The leaders of my Church tirelessly lobbied for the UN to stand against the war. They even wrote directly to the White House. I guess the leaders in neighboring Muslim countries were too busy at the brothels or something, eh?

HAMAS IS ONLY TWO YEARS OLD!! They won the election democratically. Palestinians have been suffering since it was colonized by Britain.

They could have the resources of one of the most-advanced countries on the planet if they would, you know, STOP shooting rockets at them....

You can't blame that on Hamas. How about blaming it on the siege and 10,000 illegal settlements around Gaza.

Isreal has withdrawn, yet they still attack. Under the UN charter, Isreal has a right to defend itself regardless of your grievances. Coming from an American who hates the USA and who uses Islam to issue forth a greivance campaign,

You are mixing a civil conflict with the Afgan war. Afganistan was ruled by many warlords before the U.S. arrived.

Afghanistan was ruled by the Taliban, except for a small peice in the north.

The Taliban has not been defeated, do you watch the news?

They no longer run Afghanistan and are hiding in the mountains like cowards. Don't tell me you consider that a victory? LOL

Help? So that's what you call the murder of hundreds of thousands of civilians.

Sorry, but the only real violence happening in the Middle East these days is Muslims killing Muslims.

Terrorists have homes too. They don't live in space. There were not terrorist fighting in Afghanistan before the war.

Yes, they were. Bin-laden was there and his followers planned the 9-11 attacks and they were given shelter by the Taliban. They also had terror training camps all over Afghanistan. They commited an act of war by attacking the USA , and under the UN Charter, we have a right to defend ourselves and did just that.

And you say I don't watch the news?

Just a government that the West did not like. The West creates resistance.

Actually, the resistance movement in Afghanistan worked with the USA to drive out the Taliban.

My ancestors were very far from the Vatican during this time. Despite, I don't remember the Islamic empire moving towards Italy.

It did. Several times, several raids.

The reason why the Crusades were waged was because Europeans were killing each other. They decided that the only way to unite was to kill Muslims so they waged the crusades.

The Crusades happened over a period of over 200 years. During that time, many European nations were still at war with one another. Had the Europeans united, they would have easily crushed all of the Muslim armies and conquered the Middle East much sooner.

They would probably have to pay taxes. Historically, Jews always excelled within Islamic empires. You should look at what is called the Golden age is Spain, where Jews became very wealthy and prosperous under Muslim rule.

Really? Did the Jewish tribes in Arabia excel? I guess not since they were exterminated!

We all know what happened after, the Catholic, Spanish Inquisition.

Yes, actually, Spain became the dominant power in the world and ruled the seas. Perhpas it is time for Saudis to convert to Catholicism. You should too, Nura.

Welcome to the reality of the Palestine's. They are not even recognized as citizen of their OWN nation. They are not able to leave and return! No passports, Nothing!! No free movement among their territories! Mothers, sisters, brothers, can't visit each other if one lives in Gaza and the other in the West Bank. There are families who live in theme area who have not seen each other for years because of the blockade.

As a former UN worker, it's pretty tough to recognize a place like Palestine for independence with such instability. It would not be in the best interests of the Palestinians or its neighbors at this time.

Well, that's what you get when you put terrorists and false Muslims in charge. Like you said earlier, they were democratically elected, so who's to blame?

The Palestinains themselves!

There's no way out of it for them this time! They have made their bed and now must lie in it!

They have no right to eat, drink, or live all the while being murdered and killed by land, air and sea. The holy has never been ruled so cruelly.

Then how do they survive? It must not be too bad if they can afford rockets to fight an offensive war against Isreal and even get soldiers up to Lebanaon. I don't think they have it so bad, and if they do, I don't see you contributing to relief efforts. Guess you'd rather waste your time on here trying to convince people of your opinion? Good luck, Nura. you might as well join facebook with all the teenage ranters on there.

Bin Laden is not Afghani, Palestinian, or Iraqi in case you didn't know. His cause is different that people of occupied lands.

According to him, that is part of his cause. It's step one for him to rule the world. I seem to get the impression you would like that.

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